MuggleCast | The #1 Most-Listened to Harry Potter Podcast 3

MuggleCast EP11 Transcript


Andrew [Show Intro with music in background]: This is MuggleCast - Episode 11 for October 16, 2005. If you haven't finished reading Book 6 yet then you probably do not want to listen to this podcast because we talk about several different [whispers] spoilers!

Hey, everyone! Welcome to Episode 11 of MuggleCast. This is the show where we bring you the latest news, theories, discussions, cookie recipes. Anything you can imagine relating to Harry Potter, right here on the show.

[Laura and Eric laugh]

Andrew: I'm Andrew Sims.

Kevin: I'm Kevin Steck.

Eric: I'm Eric Scull.

Laura: And with a fully functioning headset this week, I'm Laura Thompson.

Andrew: Ah, you sound so much clearer.

Laura: Oh. Thank you.

Kevin: She does.

Laura: I know.

Andrew: It's great.

Kevin: Ah. [Laughs]

Andrew: Before we move on, it's not another episode of MuggleCast without Micah first updating us on the past week's top news stories.


All right, Andrew.

On Friday, Goblet of Fire tickets went on sale at and If you haven’t already, make sure you purchase your tickets as soon as possible.

Additionally, earlier this week, Apple released the Goblet of Fire theatrical and teaser trailers in high-definition. As always, we have plenty of movie clips, pictures, interviews, poster and calendar scans over on MuggleNet’s Main Page.

A lengthy and detailed 51-page document on the actors and actresses starring in Goblet of Fire has hit WB's publicity website. Of particular interest were comments on Mad-Eye Moody and the scene involving the Hungarian Horntail.

Wrapping up the movie news, on October 16th, HBO Asia will broadcast the third Harry Potter film, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban. They have announced that they will be showing an exclusive sneak peek at the fourth movie, as well as giving away two tickets for the world premiere of Goblet of Fire in London.

On Tuesday night, JK Rowling picked up two awards at the first annual Quill Awards. The latest installment in the Harry Potter series earned her the accolades for both "Book of the Year" and "Children's Chapter Book/Middle Grade”. She was quoted as saying, “I am still not used to the idea that so many people across the world are intimately familiar with the characters who, for so long, I alone knew. Awards like this, where readers themselves vote, are therefore especially meaningful to me." You can watch the awards October 22nd on NBC.

Finally, one of the men involved in the robbery of two copies of Half-Blood Prince last June, Aaron Lambert, 20, appeared before Northampton Crown Court on Monday. He has admitted to theft and possession of an imitation gun and is being held in custody. Well pal, I have a feeling you’ll have plenty of time to read Half-Blood Prince now.

That’s all the news from our News center in New York for this October 16, 2005 edition of MuggleCast. Back to you guys!

Jail Break!

Andrew: All right. Thanks, Micah...

Micah: You're welcome!

Andrew: Guys, we have a big show... Eh, Micah?

Micah: Yeah?

Andrew: [Acting puzzled] Are you supposed to be here this week on the show? I mean, we didn't have you scheduled in or anything.

Micah: Well, I came up for a breath of fresh air from the Transcript Dungeon, so I figured I would stop in and see how things were going.

[Laura laughs]

Andrew: Oh. Oh. Okay. Well. Well, welcome Micah, everybody, to this week's show! He'll be joining us this week. I guess. Can you handle it, Michael? Micah?

[All laugh]

Micah: I think I can handle it.


Andrew: Well, we have a lot to discuss this week. So much to cover. So many new pictures. If only we could go through each one. First of all, let's get through a couple of announcements. Ben isn't here this week with us. Dead silence. That pretty much explains it.

Eric: And there was rejoicing in the streets.

Laura: Darn!

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: And there was rejoicing in the streets.

Micah: Oh boy.

[All laugh]

Eric: No, I love Ben.

Andrew: Well, before we move on to our main discussion, first I want to talk to you guys about helping us out in the ratings. Now, as you know we are on iTunes, which we can't really control how high up on the list we are unless we have subscribers. But Podcast Alley,I know most of you have heard of it, and we have a link to it on We ask that once a month, just vote for us. All you have to do is click on the link at that says "Vote For Us On Podcast Alley," click on that, insert your e-mail, then confirm your e-mail with them, and then it will count as a vote for us. And, we like being high up on that list, in the Top 10. I'm sure we can make it to No. 1!

Eric: It makes us feel special.

Andrew: Yeah. Just do it once a month because they reset the votes each month. So, it is like a whole new contest every month - kind of strange. And also, Yahoo! premiered their brand-new podcasting service, which is a lot like iTunes, only it has can submit your own user reviews and rate the shows. And for those of you who might have noticed our podcast tags got a little spammed with some...

Kevin: Inappropriate...

Andrew: Yeah. It's happening on other podcasts' listings too, not just ours. Clearly, Yahoo! really didn't think that whole think through. So, if you could just give us a vote over there, get us up on the rankings, show how much you love us, that would be really great.

Kevin: Yeah. And try to...

Andrew: Just do it once a month.

Kevin: Also, try to add tags that are relevant to our podcast.

Andrew: Yeah.

Kevin: To outweigh those which have been spammed.

Andrew: I like Yahoo!. I think it's a lot better than iTunes because it's interactive, but it has its weaknesses too - like that tag.

Kevin: It's a little too far with the interactivity.

Andrew: Yeah. Yeah. So we put in a complaint into Yahoo!.

Kevin: Yeah.

Andrew: And we don't want to send you guys out after them until...

Kevin: Until we know...

Andrew: Well, we probably will. [Laughs] At least not yet.

Kevin: Tomorrow. Tomorrow.

Andrew: Yeah.

Kevin: If you don't respond by tomorrow Yahoo!, you're getting a lot of e-mails.

Andrew: They are dead!

Contest Update

Andrew: Eric, Contest update! The Contest is now closed. We've already announced the winners.

Eric: Yes. As promised, the list was up at the release of Episode 10. Overall, it was a really good contest. We really enjoyed reading the entries and hopefully everybody enjoyed voting on them and seeing the final list, which is up on MuggleNet now. Also, as promised we have to announce the Top 3 Winners right here on MuggleCast, right now! You guys cool with that?

Kevin: Sounds good.

Eric: In Third Place we have Tim Tugendhat whose entry was, in order to kill Lord Voldemort once he was mortal, the entry was to "Play tug of war with him with the Veil in the middle. Let Grawp pull on your side."

[All laugh]

Eric: Dead silent. Dead silence. You guys suck! All right.

Andrew: No. That worked. What we just said.

Eric: Once again these were voted on and the top few really won by a lot of votes. It was pretty steady. Now. Yes. Okay.

Andrew: Second Place?

Eric: Well, Tim has won a House scarf of his choosing from the Alivan's Store.

Andrew: What color did he pick?

Eric: I'm not sure yet.

Andrew: Ohhh.

Eric: I was talking with him and he was indecisive.

Andrew: Oh, okay.

Eric: Anyway. Once again this Contest is co-sponsored by Alivan's and all our prizes are coming from Alivan's. In Second Place we have Moldy Crow - they chose to be credited as Moldy Crow - whose winning entry was to "Put Voldemort on a blind date with Umbridge."

Andrew: Oh, that would be pretty nasty.

Laura: That would do anyone in.

[All laugh]

Eric: Yes, it would.

Micah: What's wrong with Umbridge?

Kevin: Okay...

[Laura laughs]

Eric: Micah, there's nothing wrong with Umbridge, but, moving on... Okay, and in First Place the winner Cristin Atkins has won...Her entry was... Well, due to the nature of it why don't you take it away, Micah! Can you read Cristin's winning entry?

Micah: Sure. ***News Flash*** He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named was found smothered under a buffalo yesterday. Apparently, Voldemort (yes, since he's dead, we'll name him) was a bit lax on his spell pronunciations, and like the wizard Baruffio said 's' instead of 'f' and found himself on the floor with a buffalo on his chest. However, since Voldemort was not found for seven days, he suffocated. The buffalo is now being hailed as "The beast who sat."

[All laugh]

Andrew: Nice.

Laura: That was cute.

Andrew: And that one received 2,292 votes.

Eric: That is entirely correct, Andrew.

Andrew: And the total number of votes we received was 14,163. That's only a fraction of our listener base, but...

Eric: But, it's pretty darn good.

Andrew: Yes. Big turnout.

Eric: And, also one final part of this Contest Announcement. Cristin Atkins will be on the show as a guest co-host person.

Andrew: Next week.

Eric: Next week or next week's show. Yeah.

Laura: More girls. Yay!

Andrew: It will be next week. Yeah.

Eric: More girls. So, she is actually a, I believe, a schoolteacher.

Laura: We will take over.

Eric: She is actually I believe a schoolteacher.

Kevin: Oh, that's cool.

Andrew: Oh really?

Eric: So, that's going to be interesting.

Kevin: Oh, geez.

Eric: I think she teaches the middle school grades, possibly sixth. Yeah.

Andrew: Very nice. Very nice.

Eric: Cool beans!

Andrew: And what did she win? Did you already say that?

Eric: She did win a Limited Edition Padauk Wand Michael Brolly Design from Alivan's. And...

Andrew: Oooohhh.

Eric: Oooohhh. And also, I forgot to mention. Moldy Crow in Second Place - we have not heard from you. I did contact you using voldemort at staff dot mugglenet dot com. If you could check your e-mail and get back to us. Otherwise, we have to shift the prizes down and the Fourth Place winner will win something.

Andrew: [in high pitched voice] Okay! He just said "Okay!"

[All laugh]

Eric: And that will be... I love that voice! And that will be done later. The Third Place and Fourth Place were rather close. It was like an eleven vote difference.

Andrew: Oh, wow!

Eric: Yeah. It was tight, but that's it.

Andrew: So Fourth Place winner - keep an eye on your e-mail because you might just win.

Eric: Might just get something.

Andrew: Not sure.

NYC Live Podcast Update

Andrew: And also once last final update on the New York City, the big event in New York City, our podcast with PotterCast and MuggleNet combined. To create PuggleCast. That was sent in by someone.

[All laugh]

Kevin: PuggleCast.

Andrew: MuggleCast + PotterCast = PuggleCast. We're actually having a hard time thinking up a name for the show.

Kevin: A lot of people suggested the Leaky Mug.

Andrew: The Leaky Mug?

Eric: The Leaky Mug? That's clever.

Kevin: It is.

Andrew: A Leaky Mug.

Eric: The Leaky MugCast.

Laura: Hmmm.

Andrew: We leak with...

Eric: With...

Andrew: Terrible jokes.

Eric: We drip Potter ounces.

Kevin: Okay. Nice try.

[All laugh]

Micah: Ummm.

Andrew: Mixes with your morning cup of Joe.

Eric: I will come up with this. I'm going to think of something by the end of the show.

Andrew: Yeah. So, if you haven't RSVPed by now, you can send if your reservations to show up to the show to hp live at gmail dot com. Now, just because you RSVPed doesn't guarantee you a spot because we have at least, [Laughs] oh, I'd say 500 people reserved for the show! And it's funny because the room that we are in can only hold 200-300. So, you will want to get there early. There's going to be 200-300 seats. We're going to pack in as many people as possible without violating any fire regulations, but it is really going to be a great time. And, we will be more than happy to meet everyone afterwards.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: And, that's it. We'll keep providing updates on the stuff. I know a lot of you have been asking about exact times for the show and just reserving spots, but we got one reservation for a group of fifteen people. [Laughs]

Laura: Wow.

Andrew: So...

Eric: Wow.

Andrew: Yeah. We're going to be packed. The plan is that our feed is going to be going through the entire store.

Eric: Right.

Andrew: You can stand up front and we'll be more than happy to meet everyone, EVERYONE!

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: And I didn't tell everyone yet, but the entry fee is $30.00. You can give that to me at the door.

[All laugh]

Laura: And they are all going to sign autographs for you.

Eric: Andrew, you're going to be setting up the cast. I'll be there.

Andrew: Just kidding! No entry fee!

Eric: Just to be clear. No entry fee!

Andrew: Yeah. No entry fee! It's just a joke!

Eric: Can I clear up that I will be there too? Okay.

Andrew: Yeah. Eric's going to be there.

Kevin: Oh, you are going to be there?

Andrew: Kevin will be there.

Eric: Yeah. I'll be there.

Kevin: I don't know if I'm going to show up now.

Micah: I'll be there.

Andrew: Micah will be there.

Eric: Oh yeah, I'll be there.

Laura: Laura won't be there.

Eric: Awww.

Andrew: Awww, Laura!

Kevin: Why not?

Laura: I'm poor!

Eric: Oh!

Kevin: Oh!

[Laura laughs]

Andrew: Well, for those of you who want to give Laura money to come up.

Laura: Yeah! That should be your Listener Challenge this week.

[Micah and Andrew laugh]

Laura: Send Laura money so she can go to New York.

Eric: We can pool the MuggleNet funds, can't we?

Laura: That would be so cool.

[All laugh]

Andrew: We don't have MuggleNet funds.

Laura: Yeah. I know.

Eric: Yeah! That's right. Yeah!

Laura: We're all poor.

Andrew: We work at McDonald's.

Eric: They all go back into the server and stuff.

Andrew: Right.

Main Topic - Draco Malfoy

Andrew: So, this week's main discussion is Draco Malfoy. ALL about Draco Malfoy. Whatever you can think of is Draco Malfoy. We're going to be covering lots of things. Eric, you have one topic you want to start off with first. He's a very interesting character.

Eric: Oh...yeah!

[Laura laughs]

Eric: No. Sorry. Okay. I was...

Kevin: We're keeping that in.

Laura: Yeah, leave that in.

Eric: I was giving an example of what we could talk about, about Draco. These character discussions are good because then we can talk about all six books at once. Actually, Micah had a favorite editorial of his on MuggleNet that he wanted to bring up. Would you like to discuss that, Micah?

Micah: Sure. Basically, what is was about was Draco being a werewolf, as opposed to him...Well, he's still working for Lord Voldemort, but kind of under the guise of being a werewolf. And what he showed Borgin in the shop was a werewolf bite as opposed to the Dark Mark. I didn't know what you guys thought about that. It was a pretty interesting editorial.

Andrew: Now, why would someone think it was a werewolf bite?

Micah: Well, the person in this editorial argued it because he uses the name Fenrir Greyback when he threatens Borgin, and isn't that an odd name to use out of nowhere to threaten Borgin?

Eric: He could have used Voldemort.

Laura: Well, that is a good point seeing as though we do know that Greyback likes to go after children and adolescents. It is a valid point.

Kevin: Yeah, but do you think he would go after a kid of a fellow Death Eater?

Laura: Honestly, I think it was the Death Mark...Dark Mark...Death Mark.

Kevin: I do too.

Laura: Okay. Laura just woke up everyone. I do think it was the Dark Mark, but that is a very valid point and I do think it probably made for an interesting editorial.

Kevin: I know that in the past, he had said that he was something different than human, like I think I've heard vampire before because of his composure. How they explain his skin and how he looks. You know? Much like Snape and the fellow Death Eaters. They tend to say they almost look withdrawn, dead, stuff like that.

Micah: Right. And in this editorial, I think it was a girl, we have to maybe get her name. If you have it, Eric? Do you have it?

Eric: Harry Seeker. Harry Seeker. Yes.

Micah: Okay. So...

Eric: It's not a name, but it is Harry Seeker.

Micah: Okay. She actually compares a lot of quotes between Malfoy in Half-Blood Prince and Lupin in previous books and how the same kind of character traits are used to describe both of them.

Eric: Such as shadows under the eyes.

Micah: Right.

Eric: I like it. I like the editorial as a whole. I think it presents its case clearly with the dark shadows beneath the eyes and stuff, which was taken from the scene where Harry finds him in the bathroom in Half-Blood Prince. However, I think that the shadows under his eyes and him looking ill and the stuff that's quoted in this editorial, I think that was more due to the fact that he was under a tremendous amount of pressure to go after Dumbledore or whatever Voldemort's assignment for him was. So even though he does look ill, and does have shadows under his eyes, I think it is more because he's under pressure than because he's a werewolf, but still this was an interesting editorial.

Laura: Well, okay. Do you guys think he is evil?

Andrew: Oh, yeah.

Kevin: That's a good question. I think he's unsure of himself. He's grown into a role that isn't who he really is and he is sort of realizing now that he's older that he has a choice, and I think that was best shown at the end of Book 6 when he was being spoken to by Dumbledore. And he was very unsure of himself.

Andrew: Yeah, well that was the theme I think in Half-Blood Prince.

Laura: Uh huh.

Kevin: Yeah.

Andrew: Where he's changing. And he's definitely, he's got to be evil. Just look at him now. Look at the position he's in now. He can't get out of it.

Laura: I think Draco, I don't think that he is a good person. I don't think he has the same type of morals that somebody like Harry would have. But like Dumbledore said, I don't think he's a killer. Everyday we're always saying, "Oh, I'm going to kill this person," because they make us so mad, but if you were actually faced with it, faced with the one person that you hate so much, would you actually be able to do it? I mean nine times out of ten it would be, "No!"

Kevin: Definitely.

Laura: I think Draco, he's... If you compare him to people in the 1950s and such, people who were racists. Most of the time, these people were not able to run out and kill people. They just sat at home and were bigots, which is what I think Draco is.

Eric: Laura, that's really good.

Laura: Thank you.

Kevin: But don't you think he is sort of been forced into that?

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: Yeah. I do.

Kevin: The fact that he doesn't have the same morals as Harry, comes from the fact they he grew up in a family that taught him that.

Laura: I think that Draco is very power-hungry and when he was handed this opportunity, he bit off way more than he could chew. He didn't know what he was getting himself into.

Eric: Oh, completely.

Laura: And I don't think he really started to realize it until he got back to Hogwarts and he started, he tried to... You could tell because every time he tried to, when he tried to poison Dumbledore, that was just lame. The chances of Dumbledore actually getting that.

Eric: Yeah.

Laura: That was between slim and none, so you know that he was losing his steam and really I don't think he really had it in him to do it.

Eric: Yeah. Draco, I like what you said about him. And I think so too. I think all throughout Half-Blood Prince, he's been faced with things that he's finding that he cannot do. And is he a good person like Harry? Of course not. But I still believe, I still truly think that in Book 7, he is going to play a good, good part or at least start respecting Harry a little bit more because his father is gone. And, one thing I wanted to point out was Voldemort gets his followers to do what they want because...based on power. And Dumbledore, see you need to be very good at what you do for Voldemort to be pleased with you as his servant. You need to be effective. You need to have power. And Draco is finding now that he is not that powerful and he's displeasing Voldemort and he's probably fearing for his life. The thing with the good side, and I think the thing that appealed to him most when Dumbledore was talking to him, was that you don't need to have a specific amount of skill to be on the good side. You just need to hold the belief in wizard-kind and you need to think good in a way. You don't actually have to be powerful.

Laura: You have that faith, basically.

Eric: You have to, yeah. And yes, he was raised to be bad, but, and clearly Draco is ignorant too because in "Spinner's End," in Chapter 2 of Book 6, Narcissa has to go and tell Snape about how the Dark Lord is only using him to get back at Lucius and stuff like that. And all this stuff is happening over Draco's head, and I just think he's really, really gotten himself into trouble.

Micah: That's an interesting point. Do you think he wants to do it or do think he feels a necessity to do it because his parents may be threatened in some way?

Eric: Maybe threatened or maybe made threats...what do you mean?

Kevin: I don't think they've been threatened, his parents, at all because...

Eric: No.

Kevin: ...that would be the wrong move for any leader to do. To threaten the family who is following you in order to get the kid to do something. But, I think that he's been threatened before with his own life whether or not he'd be able to accomplish it or not. Sort of like "If you don't get this done, then something will happen to you." And I think that's why his parents were so concerned, like Narcissa, because she knew that if Voldemort decided to kill him, she could do nothing. She would have to watch. And he was being treated as an adult wizard in Voldemort's eyes and he was responsible for what he did, and she saw him as her son who was not an adult yet and walking into something he couldn't handle. Biting off more than he could chew.

Laura: I think... Sorry. I think it might be a little bit of both just because Draco's been brought up this way. He feels like he has this obligation to fulfill what Voldemort has asked him to do, and now that he actually gets there, he's starting to have doubts. I mean that is a pretty big internal struggle. To be brought up this way. To be brought up hating anyone who wasn't pureblood. Hating anyone who accepted Muggleborns and half-bloods into their school and then be able to get there and not do anything even when that person was at their most defenseless. That... I honestly did feel sorry for Draco during Half-Blood Prince because you see he is growing up a lot in the same way Harry is, obviously in different directions. Harry is finally accepting his role as "The Chosen One" and then you see Draco having doubts and sees that he has other options, but he's been brought up thinking he's not allowed to take them.

Kevin: He's almost trapped.

Laura: Yeah. He's between a rock and a hard spot.

Eric: Yeah, he is trapped.

Kevin: Do you think that Draco has a chance of getting out, or do you think that he's just going to be stuck?

Laura: I really don't know. Honestly, I can't really see Draco coming (and this may be my own personal opinion that I wouldn't really like to see this happen), but Draco coming and becoming best friends with Harry and helping him kill Voldemort. I really couldn't see that happening. I could see Draco helping Harry, but not directly. Something he does ends up in Harry's favor.

Kevin: Purposefully or inadvertantly?

Eric: Laura. I like that.

Laura: It could be totally inadvertantly, I think.

Eric: Now, what I want to happen. I kind of wanted mention... I think a threat to Draco's own life would probably appeal to him or be more effective than a threat to his family just because Draco does like being alone and we've seen him venture off in Diagon Alley and stuff. He likes doing his own stuff and he likes being responsible for his own actions. He just can't handle it. But, as for him in the inner circle or whatever of Voldemort, doing something in favor of Harry, I think I like this idea that there are people in Voldemort's inner circle who have questionable, I would say, loyalty. Because Voldemort doesn't... There's Pettigrew, there's Peter Pettigrew who, it's been said before in the books, has wavering loyalty and he will shackle up to anybody who is stronger. And also, he has this life debt with Harry for letting him live. So I'm thinking Wormtail... I'm trying to see a society within the Death Eaters that is actually not necessarily good, but if the time came, would they be able to do something that might help Harry destroy Voldemort? I believe Snape might be in that circle and now Draco.

Kevin: Well, I think that a lot of the Death Eaters followed Voldemort originally because he was the most powerful, so if something happens to sway that scale - right now with Dumbledore dead I am sure they are thinking they chose the right side, but if something happens to Harry, and I have gotten quite a few voicemails regarding this. A lot of people view Harry right now as not powerful enough to defeat Voldemort by himself. And I agree. He hasn't, I mean he's shown quite a bit of talent, but compared to the fight they had at the end of the Order of the Phoenix, Voldemort and Dumbledore, Harry is nowhere near that stage.

Eric: And the weird language that Dumbledore was speaking. He doesn't know anything like that.

Kevin: Exactly. He's very...

Eric: It wasn't even mentioned before.

Kevin: Currently, he's almost ignorant compared to the level of Dumbledore and Voldemort, but if something changes to sway that scale where Harry starts learning by himself and starts picking up these skills that are required to defeat Voldemort, then I would like to see how the Death Eaters are going to react because they are going to start saying, "Wait a second. The person who is fated to (well they don't know he's fated to, not everyone), the person who is known to be the only person who is going to able to fight Voldemort, which is Harry Potter, is suddenly becoming powerful, if not more powerful than Dumbledore was. Now what are we doing?" You know?

Eric: And I think...

Kevin: You know? Sort of questioning their loyalty due to the fact that Voldemort isn't on top anymore. And I think that is what happened to Draco. He saw Voldemort in such a great light, thinking he was a hero to him because he was so evil and stuff like that, but when he got actually into his inner circle, he realized that it wasn't as good as they made it out to be.

Eric: Also, with the Death Eaters, I'm trying to call it, I guess, a lack of love because if you realize Voldemort doesn't love his followers, and he just likes them for their power. And it is not that the Death Eaters need love. I'm sure everybody needs love, but one of the reasons, Sirius believed that Regulus... Sirius Black told us or told Harry that his whole family thought Voldemort had the right idea. They weren't into as much cruelty and torture as Voldemort was because obviously Voldemort has a twisted messed-up soul, but I think the thing that distinguishes the Death Eaters is their ability to hate, but also their ability to do something about it. And the Death Eaters do have a kind of course of actions, so they are in a sense, a worse people than the good side. They aren't just with Voldemort because he's powerful. They also do truly hate some people and have the ability to make things happen. But unlike Dumbledore, I wanted to say that Voldemort does not love his followers and I think that will be a severe issue, because if they are not respected and not trusted, I think eventually overthrow him.

Laura: That's a really, really good point. And relating to that I think that Voldemort has gotten a lot of the people who were just sitting at home and saying, "I like that ideal," but were too cowardly to go out and actually prove that they liked that. I think he's gotten a lot of those people involved because they think that Voldemort is now the most powerful wizard out there and they think, "Oh! Now that he's got control, I might not have to do so much killing. I'm not going to have to go out there and fight so much because he's got the upper hand." But, what is going to happen now that things are starting to waver? You know?

Eric: Then they are all going to be brought into... It's the perfect, I think it is the perfect Nazi allegory or the perfect Nazi parallel.

Laura: It is.

Eric: The parallel. Because you have the people... Basically, the Nazism as I understand it was a window for hate. It was the opportunity to hate. They channeled, Hitler and the Nazis channeled common citizens' hate and turned it against people, turned it against the Jews and everybody.

Laura: It's what happens when you let bullies get into power, basically. Sadly.

Andrew: One last question and then we will wrap it up. What would have happened if Draco made friends with Harry in Book 1?

Kevin: What do you mean?

Laura: Ooohhh.

Kevin: Which way do you mean?

Andrew: Would it have been a completely different ballgame?

Kevin: By which way? Do you mean Harry making friends with Draco, like taking his offer to become friends or Draco making...

Andrew: Right. That! That moment right there. Would it have been a whole different ballgame?

Kevin: I think so. Absolutely.

Andrew: Would Harry have gone evil or would Draco have gone nice? Hmmm.

Kevin: Well, the whole fact that point was that Harry had the choice to choose between somebody who was obviously good, which was Hermione and Ron and stuff like that, and someone who was bad, who was Draco. He knew Draco was bad. So, I think if Harry had made the choice to join Draco it would have been showing something about Harry that Harry was choosing someone he knew was bad over someone he knew was good.

Andrew: But, then there's...

Laura: Right.

Eric: And actually I think...

Kevin: It was one of those turning point moments where JK Rowling was just trying to show you the personality of the person, of her hero. You know?

Eric: And I think it goes a little bit before he even knew Ron and Hermione because if you remember in Madam Malkin's shop, when he first met Draco, clearly I don't think they could have been friends because clearly they are two completely different people. And I think that is really the point. How different they are and how they were completely brought up. If you notice when he's talking about Hagrid, Draco views him as a servant, a savage with a hut. Clearly, they've been brought up completely differently and even before he met Ron on the train, he still was not interested, or still not pleased or very happy with the type of boy Draco was with hating people. I think it really emphasizes Harry's built-in love and built-in care because he loves Hagrid. I believe the exact quote was, "I think he's brilliant!" in talking about Hagrid and Draco simply could not see that at that point. And I don't think he ever will, but will he start respecting it as another person's viewpoint? Will he turn good?

Kevin: Yeah. But, that goes back to what I was saying. If Harry had made the choice to join Draco it would have shown that Harry wasn't such a good person.

[Eric laughs]

Laura: I don't...

Kevin: And if the story had continued, I think that it would have been that Harry wasn't all that great.

Micah: I don't really see him...

Laura: I really don't think...

Kevin: It's hypothetical. There's no real way to...

Laura: know, but I really don't think that Harry and Draco could be friends. I think hypothetically speaking, Draco is far more impressionable than Harry is because I don't care that Draco has Crabbe and Goyle tagging along behind his every step. Draco is a follower - majorly - and I think you have people who have been brought up a certain way and they are able to overcome certain ideals and such that their parents pounded into their heads. I really think that hypothetically speaking if they were to become friends, Draco would be the one who would be more likely to have a better impression put upon him.

Micah: Yeah. I don't necessarily see Harry going over to Draco and basically following in the footsteps of somebody whose parents are so loyal to Voldemort when Voldemort was responsible for both the Potters' deaths. You know what I mean?

Laura: Exactly.

Eric: You know, Micah? Micah, I think that's just it. Harry is in an oppressed person in a way that he has had his family murdered. He has put up with eleven years of utter crap and utter hell from the Dursleys and every year he goes back. And that is all due to Voldemort, this person that Draco is following. So, because Voldemort has had, and because this hate has had such a profound impact on his early life and has changed his life so drastically, I don't think it's possible that Harry can sensibly turn it on.

Micah: Right.

Andrew: So the reason that JK Rowling included this in the book was just so that she could show what...

Kevin: Harry's personality.

Andrew: Yeah.

Kevin: His motives.

Laura: It's an early turning point.

Andrew: There we go.

Micah: Right. I mean it's not too far after that, that he chooses to be in Gryffindor. So, it is kind of along the same lines as choices.

Andrew: Yeah. Well, I think we beat that one to death.

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: So, there is Draco Malfoy.

Laura: We Avada Kedavraed it!

[All laugh]

Andrew: Ha ha. That's funny!

Kevin: Oh geez! That was pretty bad.

Laura: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know. I know. [Laughs]

Andrew: It's an HP dork joke. All the HP dorks are laughing.

[All laugh]

Andrew: Wow, you just coined a term that is going to be used for years and years.

Laura: Oh. Wow!

Eric: Wait, what did Laura say?

Andrew: She said... Sorry, go ahead.

Laura: I said, "We Avada Kedavraed it!"

[Andrew and Laura laugh]

Eric: Oh, God! Unless it... Laura, that's unless it has a Horcrux.

Laura: Ooohhh.

Kevin: Okay. Okay.

Andrew: Eric, you bombed! Sorry.

Laura: There's a whole new twist.

Kevin: Yeah. That was bad.

Laura: There's a whole new twist now.

Andrew: You bombed! Now moving on to...

Laura: MuggleCast is a Horcrux.

Andrew: Now...

[All laugh]

Kevin: Okay.

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October 8, 2014

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#244 (November 20th, 2011): For the first time ever, MuggleCast has a DVD commentary! Watch Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows - Part 2 on DVD with us. We'll comment on each and every scene - it's as if we're in your living room watching alongside you!

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