Trans-species Transfiguration

Andrew: Then we also found out that Bathilda had an interest in trans-species Transfiguration, which was kind of ironic seeing as she transformed into a snake.

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: So is that like cross-breeding but for magic?

Andrew: Hm?

Elysa: What?

Matt: Trans-species Transfiguration. What does that mean?

Elysa: I would assume that means that you're taking an animal and transfiguring it into a different species of like...

Matt: Or combining two species or something?

Andrew: Well, because we're species, so technically we're turning into a different species, so...

Matt: Oh, okay.

Andrew: You know what I mean?

Dumbledore and Grindewald's Relationship

Matt: Sure. Will we find out that, actually, old Bathilda, or as I like to call her, Old Bat, or Old Batty - her great nephew turns out to be the infamous...Grindlewald?

Andrew: Who cares though, honestly?

Laura: Oh.

Matt: He was a bad guy.

Elysa: Well, go for it, Andrew. Say what you really think! Who cares?

Andrew: Not me.

[Elysa laughs]

Matt: Well, we also find out that Grindlewald and Dumbledore did have a budding relationship.

Andrew: Yeah, see, now this is what I wanted to talk about.

Laura: Oh God.

Matt: See, I wanted to talk about this too.

Elysa: Oh boy.

Andrew: Is...

Matt: Let's talk about it [whispering] together.

Andrew: [laughs] Is this what J.K. Rowling - was this J.K. Rowling's one and only, like, sort of hint? One and only clue, even though it's not really even a clue, that Dumbledore was gay?

Matt: Are you still on that gay thing with Dumbledore?

Andrew: Yeah!

Laura: I don't think she was trying to leave hints in the books that he was gay. I don't think it matters.

Andrew: I don't think so either, but I just find it interesting that when you read back on it now that it's a little more interesting. I don't know.

Elysa: No, I agree with you, Andrew.

Andrew: Thank you.

Matt: He had a best friend who was the same sex as him. So does Harry.

Elysa: Yeah, but it does seem interesting, though. I think that - I mean the fact that he waited, I think it said five years before he actually felt like facing him - Dumbledore facing Grindlewald? Like I think that - why would he want to wait so long if it was just a really brief friendship, if it was just, you know, a two month, "Hey, how are you doing? We're great friends and now something terrible happens and, you know, we never speak again." I think that it was probably something really awkward and romantic there in order for Dumbledore to be avoiding that so terribly.

Matt: I can - I can probably...

Laura: That's a good point.

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Yeah. [sighs] What I love about the whole Dumbledore and Grindlewald friendship is its parallel to a bunch of the heroes/villains in the comic books. Such as, like, from the story of Superman - Lex Luther and Superman - Clark Kent used to best friends when they were children, or when they were in school.

Andrew: Yeah, that's true.

Matt: And then they turned out to be mortal enemies.

Andrew: I think...

Elysa: Good parallel.

Andrew: Why is that?

Matt: [gasps] They never meet!

[Elysa and Laura laugh]

Andrew: Is it just the classic superhero irony? Like they always started as friends, but then turn out to be worst enemies because there's always that one little thing they always competed for? The enemy, in the end, was always the one who didn't win.

Matt: I think it's also - I guess it all exemplifies the fact that they're more like equals, and they possibly know enough about each other to find their weaknesses.

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: But, Matt, kind of going off on what you were saying, what's interesting about the relationship between Dumbledore and Grindelwald that's kind of different than some of the parallels you've just mentioned is that they both originally had the same view, and it wasn't a good one.

Matt: No.

Laura: It was that whole idea that wizards should rule over Muggles for the greater good.

Matt: Okay, I have something to say off that too, Laura. I'm sorry, you finished? I didn't mean to interrupt you.

Laura: Yeah, I just kind of bringing up that point that Dumbledore wasn't originally good.

Matt: Well, this also goes to another comic book, X-Men with Magneto and Professor Xavier. They both want mutant rights, but they both go about it differently. You know what I mean?

Laura: But rights are different than...

Matt: I'm saying they both had the same views.

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: They both wanted the same goals, they just went about it differently, and I think that Dumbledore and Grindelwald share the same passion. It's just I think that Grindelwald had more of a like a Slytherin attribute where he would do anything just to boost himself, and I think that Dumbledore, as he got older, he started to realize that it's not really all about him, and he has more compassion than he thought, like the compassion to love.

Laura: Yeah, and I mean I also think Dumbledore came to his senses and realized that the whole philosophy they'd been holding when they were younger was wrong.

Matt: Possibly. He was probably just trying to do it to be - to show off to Grindelwald or something.

Elysa: This is - this is going to be a real stretch, and I don't know if this would make any sense to you guys, but I was thinking that maybe part of the reason that Dumbledore went along with this - maybe he sort of had these ideas and sort of experimenting with ideology and where he stands with certain issues, and then Grindelwald came along, and he was sort of the force that pushed him over the edge. He was influence, he just sort of succumbed to peer pressure. And that was just - so then once Grindelwald was out of his life he sort of reverted back to questioning things a bit more.

Matt: Well, he probably...

Laura: Yeah, and I think you're right to say that. Sorry, Matt. I think you're right to say that, because, not to jump too far ahead, but in the King's Cross chapter, when Harry's sort of in that world of limbo between life and death, doesn't Dumbledore say something about being infatuated with Grindelwald?

Elysa: Yes, he does.

Matt: Yes, he does actually.

Elysa: Which again is a play to the - Andrew's original idea that maybe there's something more going on there. That that was the hint that J.K Rowling had always alluded to, and it would also explain why someone as strong willed as Albus Dumbledore would succumb to peer pressure. Of course the average person would succumb much easier if you have a crush or are in love with someone or, as Dumbledore puts it, an infatuation.

Matt: I think it's definitely more of an infatuation than anything.

Elysa: Right, I agree.

Matt: I think he just - I'm sure that Grindelwald was pretty persuasive, and he pretty much made his beliefs pretty - what's the word I'm trying to think of? Make it very...

Andrew: Clear?

Elysa: He had strong convictions?

Matt: Yeah. And he made it sound so great and so reachable, and I bet he could've said like, "We could do it together," and, you know, "we can be the best team."

Elysa: Right. Well, that makes total sense because think about it. He has Aberforth at home, who he was - and even if he got along with him they weren't the best of friends. Or according to the reports, of course, the Rita Skeeter article. But then I think it says also that his best friend at school was Doge, right?

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Yes.

Elysa: Yeah, and the book describes Doge as being really [unintelligible] and slow and whatnot, so maybe, you know, maybe Grindelwald was sort of meeting his match, and that's why he became infatuated. He'd been surrounded by these lesser intellectuals his entire life. And so when he finally met his match he was like, "Whoa."

Matt: Mhm. And you know whenever you find something that you really - you really connect with, sometimes it becomes addicting and you become infatuated with it, which is probably what he did with Grindelwald.

Elysa: Mhm.

Matt: He probably took it too far and he let his guard down to Grindelwald.

Andrew: Completely.

Elysa: I agree, I agree.

Andrew: And do you - now do you think this is why - we also find out Dumbledore didn't intervene with Grindelwald's - you know, the mayhem he started causing for five years. Why do you think he waited? Do you think it was because of that infatuation?

Matt: I think that he felt - I think this was like a transformation point for him when he was looking at all the things that Grindelwald was doing. And he was probably searching his soul seeing if he's the kind of person that can do that. Kind of like with Harry and the Unforgivable Curses. He knows - Harry knows that he can't produce those kind of spells, and I think Dumbledore found what kind of person he really was, and he wasn't the person that he kept portraying himself to Grindelwald for.

What Happened to Ariana?

Laura: Yeah, I agree with that. So we know that Ariana was attacked by a group of Muggles and that, essentially afterward, at the least the impression that I got of it, was that she pretty much kind of crawled back into her shell and never was able to practice magic again.

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Well, if she wasn't allowed to practice magic, I mean she was being attacked by Muggles, and isn't it...

Laura: No, no, no.

Matt: ...a rule that underage wizards can defend themselves with magic when they're being attacked?

Laura: But I don't think she was of age to have attended Hogwarts.

Matt: Ooooh.

Andrew: She was only six.

Laura: I don't think she was old enough to do anything.

Matt: Oh, she's only six, okay. That's what I was wondering.

Laura: But, you know, I'm almost wondering what exactly happened to her, because just the vagueness with which it's described almost sounds like a sexual assault to me.

Elysa: I agree.

Laura: Like - and just the idea - and like afterwards she didn't do magic anymore, she was no longer magical, it just seems like they came and robbed her of that somehow.

Matt: It does make sense.

Laura: And the first thing that comes to my mind was she was sexually assaulted.

Matt: It does definitely make sense because she does have this kind of attributes that happens to a victim of a sexual assault.

Laura: Yeah, because afterwards she, you know, isolates herself.

Elysa: Submissive...

Laura: And also her family wants to protect her, you know, her mom keeps her inside all the time after that. But then what's interesting is that later, in the passage from Rita Skeeter's book, she bascially tries to imply that Dumbledore killed his sister because maybe she stumbled onto something she shouldn't have seen. And she even says, "Is it possible that Ariana Dumbledore was the first person to die for the greater good?" And it's just - you know, it's just another one of those moments where you read it, and having known Dumbledore through six books, the idea that anyone would even suggest that he would kill his sister just infuriates you!

Elysa: No, I sort of - I thought maybe that Grindelwald had done it, whether inadvertently or otherwise, and that maybe that was the reason that they never spoke again. And maybe...

Laura: Oh no, I agree with you, but what Rita Skeeter is trying to imply in her book is that Ariana died for Dumbledore's cause, that he was somehow responsible for it, and that just irks me.

Matt: Well, whatever happened - well, whatever happened in Ariana's death had to have made Dumbledore feel at guilt, so it can't just have been that one incident, because...

Laura: What incident?

Matt: Or unless - do you think Dumbledore blames himself for not being there when she was attacked?

Laura: No, no, no. What happened was he - what was it? He, Grindelwald, and I think it was Aberforth, all got into a fight.

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Oh, that's right.

Laura: And then Ariana stumbled into the middle of it. So one of them killed her, but they're not 100 percent sure who. But what I was just talking about was that Rita Skeeter speculated that, and basically tried to imply, that Dumbledore purposefully killed his sister, which is ridiculous.

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Yeah. Okay, I remember that now.

Andrew: But that's naturally what Rita should do. I mean it's not like we should be too surprised by that, but...

Laura: I know.

Andrew: Were you trying to make a certain point with that?

Laura: No, no, no. I was just saying that it was irksome.

Andrew: Yeah. Oh that Rita. That's about it for that chapter.

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: The just find out about their family.

Dumbledore's Character as a Whole

Elysa: Well, I kind of wanted to touch on - I remember - okay, I remember when I was first reading this book I actually had Jess, I'm sure you guys remember Jess, with me at Chickahominey, and we were reading this, and she finished this chapter, and she was like, "I'm vindicated!" Like, "This is what I've been saying all along." You, everyone who's listening, knows about Jess and her anti-Dumbledore theories and what-not. So I kind of...

Andrew: Just for you listeners, she was on an episode way, way back, and she was - she just kept proclaiming about how much she hated Dumbledore. [laughs] But go on, go ahead.

Elysa: So anyway, I was just - I just wanted to comment on - on that because I think it's not just her. A lot of people sort of, you know, became disenchanted with Dumbledore, and I think this is the chapter that really drilled that in at least originally. But Hermione says on page 361, "Harry, I'm sorry but I think the real reason you're so angry is that Dumbledore never told you any of this himself." And I really think that's right. I mean speaking of the angry, emo Harry - But I mean don't get me wrong, of course I can't blame Harry for feeling betrayed or deceived or anything. I mean it was a shock to me to read Dumbledore's note to Grindelwald, and I think it's perfectly fair for anyone who had read this to have felt disenchanted with Dumbledore, but there's little doubt in my mind that he lost a lot of wisdom points, so to speak, in this chapter because we saw how terribly overwhelming Harry's situation was and how Dumbledore really added to that. But after the initial upset you sort of have to concede many points to Hermione. Like, she sort of goes into a spiel about "actions speak louder than words" and Dumbledore's actions have always aligned with his admirers' perceptions of him, and as she points out he more than redeems himself later in life by voting for Muggle rights as part of the Wizengamot, fighting to bring down Voldemort from the start, and a whole host of other things. And I mean I think it's clear that he had a lapse in judgment, he was really young and everything, but I think that that only makes him more realistic. My argument, ultimately, in terms of the anti-Dumbledore sentiment, is just that if anything, learning all of this about Dumbledore made him more human as opposed to merely a character.

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Exactly.

Elysa: And if he's human and well and truly human, flaws and temporarily senselessness included, it makes all of his accomplishments, his ideology, and his principal behavior 100 times more admirable and worthy of respect. So, essentially, I mean I think that - I think it probably added to Dumbledore's character reasons to like him because it made him feel more personable, we could relate to him more.

Andrew: Yeah.

Elysa: And especially – especially, sometimes people have to fall from grace in order to learn the critical lessons and gain the sort of wisdom that Dumbledore had, and I mean, he was no exception. So, I don't know, it made me like him more, honestly.

Andrew: Yeah, I...

Laura: Yeah, I agree with you completely.

Andrew: Absolutely.

Laura: I have nothing to add.

Andrew: That's - well, yeah, I just want to say that it felt really good to not only just hear about Dumbledore's early life but just to know that he was normal, like you said. I mean it was just - it was just really - I don't want to say vindicating, but it was really...nice. [laughs]

Matt: Yeah, and for any point in the series, it's probably - this was the best book to show this part of Dumbledore. For - for we always relied on Dumbledore being the - the sort of god-sent mentor of Harry.

Andrew: Right, exactly. A saint.

Matt: Yes, so now...

Andrew: And kids don't think straight when they're our age. Except for us, I mean, we produce the most popular Harry Potter podcast online. We must be geniuses.

[Elysa laughs]

Matt: Gee, gloat much?

Elysa: You know what? I just totally thought of something else, and this is going to be really, really dorky, but I remember in the Order of the Phoenix movie - do you guys remember when Sirius says something to Harry about there's light and dark in all of us and it's what you do with it, or something, that matters?

Laura: Mhm.

Matt: Mhm.

Elysa: It was - I don't know, just made me think of that even though it's totally not canon.

Matt: Yeah, not everyone's light and dark, or good and evil.

Elysa: Well, it made me - I think, I mean in terms of stepping out of the character analysis for a second, I think it brings a greater appreciation for the series in general, because I think so much of a problem with a lot of novels is that they'll show absolute evil versus absolute good, and so it's easy to choose, you know, a side, and it's easy to see what's right and what's wrong. But I think that in reality it's so much more convoluted and complex than that, and that this whole thing with Dumbledore just - you know, again made it so much more realistic.

Laura: Yeah, I agree.

Matt: Mhm.

Andrew: Did you guys know Dumbledore was 116 years old?

Laura: Yeah, he was old.

Andrew: I didn't realize he was that old.

Laura: He was older than god.

Andrew: That's crazy.

[Elysa laughs]

Chapter 19, "The Silver Doe"

Andrew: Okay, well, let's move on to Chapter 19 now, "The Silver Doe." This is where Ron comes back, and it's really...

Matt: [laughs] That was great, Andrew!

Laura: [laughs] Harry gets naked.

Matt: Ron comes back!

Andrew: This - this chapter, I don't know what to think, because Ron comes back, and I still don't fully understand it. I don't fully understand his intentions on coming back, and even Hermione was a little - uh...

Matt: Well, she beat the crap out of him.

Andrew: Well, exactly, until she was satisfied with his answer. It starts off with Harry up late one night, I guess watching the campsite. And Harry spots a silver doe, and Harry is intrigued by it and follows it to the little pond that's frozen over, and at the bottom is the sword of Gryffindor.

Harry Stripping Down for the Movie

Laura: I know - I know one thing that a lot people are really excited for is this scene in the movie because Harry strips down and dives into the icy water.

Andrew: Oh yeah, and I said...

Matt: Oh my gosh. Uh-oh. Equus.

[Laura laughs]

Andrew: My joke during Prophecy was that Jo went to see Equus while she was writing Book 7 and she decided, she said, "Damn, Dan!" So she wrote in a little half-naked scene.

Laura: That reminds me of this funny thing that Dan was talking about one time in an interview, I guess, where it was during Equus and it was one night when he knew that Jo was there. And he was on the stage naked at the time, and someone threw a stuffed animal owl up on the stage, and he said the first thought that went through his head was, "Oh my god, it's not her, she wouldn't do that."

[Andrew and Elysa laugh]

Harry Following the Silver Doe

Laura: I thought that was funny. Well, I mean, what about the fact that Harry follows the silver doe?

Andrew: Yeah, I don't - I don't think that was the brightest idea. What were you guys' reaction when you were reading this for the first time? Because mine was like, "Okay."

Laura: Mine was like, "What the hell are you doing?"

Andrew: Yeah, terrible idea.

Laura: Why?

Andrew: But I guess there's just something intriguing about seeing a Patronus just standing there in the woods. You know?

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: Yeah, I mean it's...

Andrew: And at that point they were so desperate for something new that...

Matt: Well, I have a question about the Patronus thing. I mean, how far can a Patronus go?

Andrew: Apparently...

Elysa: I think Snape was there, wasn't he?

Laura: Yeah, I thought he was.

Matt: Was he there?

Elysa: Yeah, 'cause I think there was some part where there were these two trees that were growing together, or something, and there was a very small crack between them and Harry said it was the perfect spot for someone to hide, and Ron had said that he thought someone was living behind it but he didn't stop to look because he noticed that Harry wasn't coming up.

Matt: Well, not only that, though, but also remember in the wedding when...

Elysa: Kingsley.

Matt: Kingsley sent the Patronus to warn them.

Laura: Yeah.

Elysa: Yeah, that's true.

Laura: And the Order uses Patronuses to send messages all the time.

Matt: Yeah, like what Tonks did in Book 6.

Andrew: But maybe Snape wanted to be there. I mean didn't he put the sword there?

Laura: Yeah, he did, I thought.

Andrew: Yeah, so that's why he was probably there.

Matt: But why the hell did he put it in the bottom of the lake? Why couldn't he just put it in front of the tent?

Andrew: 'Cause it takes a true Gryffindor to retrieve it!

[Elysa laughs]

Laura: No, because he wanted Harry to...

Matt: He wanted him to strip down!

Andrew: Yes, because J.K. Rowling went to see Equus and liked Dan's body! I'm telling you that's my theory.

Laura: And we wonder why she won't come on our show. [laughs]

Ron Showing his Gryffindor Traits

Andrew: Yeah, I'm sure that's why. So Ron's the one that actually retrieves the sword because Harry blacks out underwater, and then this is - we'll just skip right to when the locket - Harry figures out that he has to open it up by saying "open" in Parseltongue. Then Ron has to fight the Horcrux because two bubbles come out - Harry and Ron - who are taunting Ron and, you know, Ron has to show his true Gryffindor abilities here to just ignore them and stab the locket with the sword. What did you guys think of this scene when Ron - he's fighting these - he's fighting some of these terrible things that, frankly, I think are true. That Harry and Hermione, in these bubble forms, are telling him that he was a coward, that he was stupid, that he was the least favourite of the family...

Matt: This is what Ron has been always thinking about. This is probably what the locket was doing, was taking all of his fears or his things that he keeps worrying about and just throwing it in his face.

Elysa: Like a Boggart.

Matt: Because he's always thought of himself as the least of the family.

Laura: Yeah, I mean we even see that in the Mirror of Erised. In the first book when he sees himself holding the Quidditch Trophy and that he's Head Boy. And all these things he sees that his brothers get that he never got.

Matt: Yeah, and he also sees that he's not exactly - I mean he thinks that he's not exactly the most - dang it - most competent person of the trio. He sees that Hermione's the one that's smart, Harry's the Chosen One, but he doesn't see where he fits in.

Andrew: At that point Ron does destroy the locket, and then there's like this awkward moment where Harry had just seen everything, so it's like, suddenly, Harry has seen all of Ron's worst fears. Just that Harry and Hermione would get together, and Hermione was too good for Ron as long as Harry was around. I'm looking forward to seeing this in the movie because I hope there's like some awkward tension between all of them.

Laura: Yeah. Well, it's really awkward because Ron actually sees the fake Harry and Hermione kiss.

Andrew: Right, that too.

Laura: And that just drives him over...

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: [laughs] ...the edge. He freaks out.

Matt: Well, is it really like - they're not heads, they're just two bubbles...

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: ...that rise up from it. So...

The Horcrux's Motivation

Andrew: Do you think in a way the Horcrux was asking him to kill it? Because all these things would just anger you and make you want to destroy it, wouldn't they?

Matt: It's trying to break him is what it's trying to do.

Andrew: Yeah, but at the same time...

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: It's using every single thing that he feels bad about or feels, you know - that he knows that disturbs him the most.

Andrew: Right. I agree that it gets to him. But at the same time don't you think this could also have a negative effect for the Horcrux? Because it could annoy him - okay, we know what its intentions were, but it could possibly annoy him so much that he actually wants to destroy it more. Especially if Harry's watching - he wants to stop it and the only way to do that is to destroy it.

Matt: I don't think that it's showing him things that annoy him, though. I think it's showing things that upset him.

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: Well, upset - annoy. I sort of meant it in the same way.

Matt: Well, everyone knows there's certain kinds of things that you think about and you just break down.

Andrew: Yeah. I mean like, before Book 7 came out, we were like, okay, Harry is going to be the one to kill Voldemort because at this point Harry has so much riding on Voldemort's death. And all of this trouble that Voldemort has put him through and killing his parents. Harry's going to knock him out so easily it's going to be insane. I sort of think this is the same thing, where so much is built up. Where it's easier for Ron to just do it...

Matt: Yeah.

Andrew: ...with anger.

Matt: Well, it's - but if you think about it for another person, like for Harry, if he sees Ginny just being tortured or just calling out to Harry that, "Why did you leave me?" Or "You don't love me" or something. Do you think that he would get angry and stab it, or do you think that he would just start to break down and start crying? Elisa: I think Harry would stab it.

Andrew: I think he would stab it, too.

Laura: Yeah. I don't know. I think the whole thing is that the Horcrux - and we've talked about this before - how it can kind of tell when it's not safe. So I think in this state it knew it was threatened, and it was probably just resorting to the last thing it knew how to do.

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: Which was taunt him and try to break him down. And make him too weak and make him just leave instead of hurting it.

Matt: Well, the locket probably also felt that Ron was the weakest of the two. Because when it was opened Harry was also there, but it didn't do anything to Harry. It just went straight to Ron. And I think it knows that Ron is the most emotional of the two. And the most susceptible to it. Because that's probably why it chose him.

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: Yeah.

Hermione's Fit

Andrew: I think that's all pretty interesting. Okay, so what do you want to talk about next? Ron and Harry go back to the tent and Hermione has a little fit. What do you guys think about this fit? Was it deserved?

Laura: I thought I would have reacted the same way.

Andrew: If you were in love with Ron?

Laura: I would have been - yes, I would have been pissed. Wouldn't you, Elysa?

Elysa: Absolutely. In fact, I was glad that, you know, she got really pissed off at him. Because Harry - I mean, I understand why Harry reacted the way he did. I mean, I think both of their reactions were appropriate. But at that point in time I was so upset with Ron myself I was living vicariously through Hermione. Like, "Yes! Go, Hermione! Get him."

Matt: Well, for what he did he doesn't deserve to go unpunished. Whether or not he had the right to do it or not.

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: Well, and also just the idea that he took off when it's so dangerous right now. And them not knowing where he was. Because Harry kept hoping that he might pop up at Hogwarts on the Marauder's Map and he never did. And so it was just this long period of not knowing whether Ron was dead or alive, or if he'd made it home, or if he was still wandering around the countryside. I would have been worried out of my mind, and then the second he showed back up I would have beat the crap out of him. Just like she did.

Matt: That's the scene that I want to see in the film.

Laura: Mhm.

Matt: I want to see Emma Watson beat the crap out of Rupert Grint.

Andrew: But it's more of the same. It's more of Angry Emma Watson. The classic Angry-Panicked-Scared Emma Watson. I don't know.

Matt: Yeah, but with...

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: ...a drop-kick and, you know...

[Everyone laughs]

Elysa: Kung-fu.

Laura: I think though, probably, they'll use that to make like - I don't know, I feel like with these movies they always try to take something to make the mood a little lighter.

Matt: Yeah.

Laura: And I feel like they'll make this somewhat comical in the film, which is kind of upsetting to me because, really, when I read it, I identified with that - just the idea of being so afraid and then so angry about what he had done that it's not even funny. But I just have a feeling that they'll try and make some laughs out of it.

Andrew: But how could you not laugh seeing Hermione attack Ron?

Matt: Yeah, whether or not it's intended to laugh or not the audience is going to laugh at that scene.

Andrew: Yeah, it's funny.

Matt: I mean I laughed when I read it too.

Elysa: Well, even Hermione laughs at the end.

Andrew: Mhm.

Matt: Yeah.

Laura: Yeah, but it wasn't like - I don't know. It was more like a sinister, somewhat...

Elysa: I agree.

Matt: I think it was more like a punishment, like to her husband or something.

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: Whether she slaps him really hard in the face or we just follow Dan to the tent and then all we hear is this muffling sound and then he turns around and, you know, Rupert Grint's in a fetal position while Emma Watson is kicking him in the stomach. It's...

Laura: I don't think they're going to go that far.

Matt: I know, but I mean it's - with these kind of situations and this kind of a scene that's usually going to bring the audience to laugh. Because...

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: ...it kind of breaks the ice, but it's definitely going to...

Laura: Yeah, but I think that they're definitely going to take that scene and make it - just shoot it more comically.

Matt: Well, it's going to be kind of like Prisoner of Azkaban.

Laura: Like, Ron will come into the tent and all you'll see is Hermione's fist come in and just smack him in the face.

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: And then they'll play the light-hearted music and - I don't know, I don't like it.

[Andrew laughs]

Elysa: I agree. I feel like, yeah...

Andrew: I don't like the future.

[Andrew, Elysa, and Laura laugh]

Laura: I don't.

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