MuggleCast | The #1 Most-Listened to Harry Potter Podcast

MuggleCast 144 Transcript (continued)

Muggle Mail: Pickle Pack

Eric: The first Muggle Mail comes from Allissa, age 16, of... [pause] New York.

Micah: Schenectady, New York.

Eric: Really? Can you say that again?

Micah: Yes. Schenectady.

Eric: Dude. Sch...

Micah: Upstate New York, area code...

Andrew: [in a sing-song voice] Schenectady.

Micah: No, you'll like the area code. Okay, this is a Jeopardy trivia useful knowledge piece of information...

Andrew: M'kay.

Micah: ...sort of thing. Schenectady: area code 12345.

Andrew: Nice!

Laura: Wow. That's cool.

Matt: Wow.

Eric: Wow. So Allissa, from Schenectady, New York, area code 12345 - thanks, Micah - says:

"Hey, MuggleCasters, your last poll about who would be interested in extending Pickle Pack seemed to have a lot of people who did show interest, but then on your last episode you said how Pickle Pack had ended. So does that mean there will definitely not be a Pickle Pack extension? I started listening to your show about six months ago, so I never got to participate and would really enjoy it being opened up to everyone for a short time more. So basically, I'm just wondering if Pickle Pack is dead or not. Thanks! Allissa."

Andrew: Well, we're not accepting new subscriptions; we've decided against that.

Eric: We did.

Matt: Mhm.

Andrew: But current Pickle Pack members do still...

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: ...have access to Pickle Pack, and occasionally we'll be making little updates. But yeah, sorry, no, we're not opening it up for another year - or six months - so...

Matt: Yeah, sorry.

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: Matt, you want to take the next Muggle Mail? This is your - sort of your forte.

Matt: Yeah, okay. My forte.

Andrew: Should I say "screw-up-te??

Muggle Mail: Matt Screwed Up

Matt: [laughs sarcastically] Okay, our next Muggle Mail comes from Carrie Simpson, 31, of Saint Louis, Missouri. And Carrie writes, "Hi..."

Eric: Hi.

Andrew: Hi.

Matt: ..."During Episode" - oh, hi!

"During Episode number 143 you were talking about how once the trio exited the dragon and made it to shore, that Harry began placing protective charms around their camp for the first time, and that he was probably doing so because Hermione was a little emotional. I hate to say this, but you were wrong. He actually places the charms earlier in the book. In Chapter 16, "Godric's Hollow," the day following Ron's departure is actually Harry's first time placing the charms. The reason for him doing it, though, are the same: because Hermione is too emotional at the time. Keep up the good discussion."

I'm sorry! Okay!? I did a booboo.

Andrew: It's okay. We all make mistakes.

Matt: A mistake.

Eric: A booboo.

[Laura laughs]

Eric: A booboo.

Andrew: Micah, you want to take the next one?

Muggle Mail: Court Transcripts

Micah: Sure. The next Muggle Mail comes from Catherine A. Thomas, 34, of Caseyville, Illinois.

Andrew: Get her credentials in there.

Eric: Yeah. Seriously, man.

Andrew: She's an official.

Micah: Sorry. [laughs] Catherine A. Thomas, RPR, CSR-IL, CCR-MO, and she's 34 from Caseyville, Illinois, and she's writing in about court transcripts. She says:

"Hi MuggleCasters, long time listener, first time e-mailer. I thought I'd pipe up as it relates to how court transcripts are produced. I'm a court reporter, and it is we who produce trial transcripts. We are certified professionals who write every word of a trial or deposition proceeding as it occurs, and produce the legal transcript, which is the accurate, true, verbatim, and especially authoritative record of the proceedings. We have to have vocabularies that surpass the dictionary and reflexes that allow us to write 225-plus words a minute on our stenotype machines. This same technique is used for live closed captioning, so no, it was not some intern who made up the transcript. I know my profession is not as well known as others. However, to me it's kind of like asking if a premed student performed someone's bypass surgery."

[Andrew and Laura laugh]


"I love my work, and I highly recommend court reporting to anyone who loves the English language and wants a job where no two days are the same, and you meet people from all walks of life, even famous authors of amazing books, and if I may fan-girl a bit, I love your show. I wish I could have seen you all when you can to St. Louis. Ditto to the previous e-mailer who said Micah had a gorgeous voice. Laura rocks, and I love hearing Andrew introduce the..."

Andrew: HUH!?


"...e-mail of the day."

[Everyone laughs]

Eric: Micah, that was a really good impression.

Micah: That was...

Andrew: Yeah, Micah. You should start doing it.

Micah: Yeah, maybe.

Andrew: Yeah. We have one this week, so you can do it. What a job though!

Micah: So that's - yeah.

Andrew: What a job! I would love...

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: Damn.

Eric: 125 words...

Laura: That would be such a cool job.

Andrew: Wouldn't it be cool if they paid you per word or something? [laughs] You could just like make up extra stuff. That's a - wow - what a - seriously. I'd love to see like a story on...

Micah: It's really cool, because, I mean, when I was in court at the end of the year/beginning of January - when I was on jury duty, you just see these people sitting there. They're typing away, typing away...

Andrew: Mhm.

Micah: And then the judge or somebody else needs something read back to them, and it's just amazing how they can sit there and read this really thin piece of paper and repeat everything that was just said.

Andrew: Wow.

Eric: Wow.

Andrew: So thanks, Catherine. Props to you for your job.

Micah: Sorry. Didn't mean to call you an intern. [laughs]

Andrew: Yeah. That was partially my fault, because I was like, "Duh! Who does it? Is it like some student?"

[Laura laughs]

Andrew: I'm sorry.

Micah: I was just wondering, still, how Stanford got a hold of it. And I tried e-mailing her back to ask her that question, and for some reason the e-mail didn't work, but how would Stanford, as opposed to another law school say, get a hold of the transcript?

Andrew: Maybe it's someone who works for Stanford.

Eric: But not an intern.

Micah: It's possible, yeah.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: Not an intern. Yeah.

Micah: No.

Andrew: It's a serious professional, so...

Matt: Yeah.

Andrew: Anyway, next e-mail. Laura, want to take it?

Muggle Mail: Room of Requirement

Laura: Our next Muggle Mail comes from Becky, age older than Nicholas Flammel - her words not mine. She's from Australia. She says:

"Why didn't it occur to Voldemort that other people besides him could work out how to get into the Room of Requirement? When Harry went in, there were so many lost belongings there, and surely most of it was already there when Voldemort was a student, so he was quite silly to assume that he would be the only one to ever gain access to the room. It just seems so ridiculous, because people and House-elves have even managed to find the room just by accident, whereas with the other hiding places, as well as the Chamber of Secrets, you need specific skills, knowledge, or abilities to get in. Voldemort also didn't bother hiding the diadem. He placed it on top of the cupboard rather than in it. So what do you guys think about this?"

Eric: I agree. It's a bit of an oversight on Voldemort's part. Again, this one is particularly - I mean this one I think is one of the worst oversights of - of his thing. I mean - and this voice-mailer does - I'm sorry, this rebuttaler, Becky here - really does give a really good reason for him to have noticed that it wasn't just him who found the place because of all the other people's stuff that was there. And if you recall the exact term in Half-Blood Prince when Harry found that room was, "I need a place to stash my book" or "I need a place to store my book," something like that. And so he basically, you know, found this room where pretty much anyone, I guess, if you needed a hiding place for something, for an item, that's where you'd find it. So, Becky has a really good point here.

Laura: I think it's simply arrogance on Voldemort's part, to be perfectly honest.

Matt: Yeah.

Laura: I mean, he - just the fact that he was hiding in Hogwarts to begin with is a bit stupid, but...

Matt: I mean, 'cause they mentioned it.

Laura: Yeah, he probably just thought that there were so many other things in here that it would be impossible for anyone to even find this. And this was also at a time when he thought no one would even find out about his Horcruxes.

Micah: Right. So it would just be another item sitting there...

Laura: Yeah.

Micah: ...that nobody would take any notice of. But, I mean, it's also kind of - somebody mentioned arrogance, but it's also, I would say, a means of triumph for him because he would be hiding something in a place where, you know, really nobody would suspect it. But I also think in a way that he would see himself overcoming Dumbledore...

Eric: Interesting.

Micah: ...just by having it in that place.

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: Just self-satisfaction knowing that it's under their nose the whole time when they're looking for it.

Eric: That's a good point with all the other objects, too. And, you know, actually, this may be a big problem for Voldemort to even hide it better, but I think probably the coolest connection between Harry and Voldemort is that they both ran, and ran, and ran, and ended up turning down the same aisle and going to the same cupboard to store whatever it was they were trying to hide. 'Cause wasn't it the same exact cupboard that Harry put the book in - that Voldemort - that was where the diadem was?

Micah: I don't know.

Eric: It's the next chapter, but I'm almost positive, 'cause that's how Harry recognizes...

Micah: I'd have to go back and read...

Eric: ...and he says...

Micah: ...Half-Blood Prince.

Eric: ...there was a tiara in there, so that's - I think that's really cool.

Micah: Well, does it mention it in Half-Blood Prince?

Eric: You know, I think it does. I think there's just a - a something died in a cage and I think a tiara, but I'd have to - have to be sure. I'd have to go back, but it's next chapter anyway.

Matt: Wouldn't it be cool if Jo mentions in her encyclopedia what was the timeframe and order of how Voldemort made the Horcruxes...

Andrew: Yeah, like the story line.

Matt: ...and who he killed for each one? Because - 'cause you got to wonder when he did all this. Like, the diary is obviously the first one.

Micah: She did reveal who he killed. She didn't reveal the timeframe, though.

Matt: Who he killed for each one?

Micah: Yeah. She did.

Eric: Yeah, that was in one of the book readings.

Micah: Yeah, remember there was, like, an Albanian whore.

Matt: Oh! Yes.

Micah: That one just sticks out to me.

Eric: The Albanian whore? Gee, I wonder why.

Laura: Well, you do like goats, Micah, so...

[Everyone laughs]

Micah: Yeah, 'cause, you know, Albanian whores, goats, are just so...

Andrew: They fit perfectly.

Eric: Yeah, I think Matt's right about that, you know, kind of overlapping time - how it would be great for Jo just to go back and kind of just make it clear exactly when he did the things and what order. 'Cause, I mean, even back in Chamber of Secrets, I mean, she knows. 'Cause even back in Chamber of Secrets, she was - you know, he gave a little bit of history - the Diary Riddle gave a little bit of history, like, "In my fifth year, I found this," you know, and that was obviously continued on in Book 6 when, you know, we're following Voldemort through his early teens, so it'll be cool to see the definitive account once Jo writes that.

Micah: I have the list if you want it. Or we don't have to go through it, I guess.

Andrew: Go ahead. Read it real fast for everyone.

Micah: So for the Gaunt's ring, he killed Tom Riddle Sr. We know that. Tom Riddle's Diary he killed Moaning Myrtle. We know that. Helga Hufflepuff's Cup he killed Hepzibah Smith. We know that. Slytherin's Locket he killed a Muggle tramp. Rowena Ravenclaw's diadem - diadem. He killed an Albanian peasant. And for Nagini he killed Bertha Jordon.

Muggle Mail: Jo's Cameo

Andrew: Nagini. Yeah, okay, well, the next e-mail comes from Stacey B., 22, of [sings] Baltimore.

"Wouldn't it be cool if J.K.R. made a cameo on the last movie? Like maybe she's some random character - random Muggle on Tottenham Court Road, or some random witch at the wedding or at Gringotts. Like she won't be shown enough to be an important character but enough to know that it's her. That'd be so cool."

Eric: I heard a rumor...

Andrew: That's it.

Eric: ...that Jo was the woman who harasses Harry in Nocturn Alley in Chamber of Secrets. It kind of looks like that could be her but I think...

Andrew: I think we would have known that by now. [laughs]

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: Yeah, we would have known if...

[Laura laughs]

Eric: It was a serious rumor at one point that someone around me had dispelled at the time. I mean I think we used to get e-mails about that.

Matt: I never heard of that rumor before.

Andrew: I - I - [coughs] I always thought she looked like Harry's mother in the Sorcerer's Stone flashback. Like that the woman who plays her kind of looks like Jo.

Laura: Yeah, she does kind of.

Matt: Yeah.

Andrew: Obviously it's not.

Eric: It's the same actor that we've seen since then. That's what I like about them.

Matt: Yeah, it is!

Eric: That they had kept all the actors and actresses. I'm saying it was the same actresses.

Matt: Oh yeah.

Andrew: Next e-mail?

Who Drank the Unicorn Blood?

Matt: Our next e-mail comes from Ida, 22, of Norway. And she writes:

"Hi! I was just wondering about the unicorn blood. Was it actually Voldemort who drank the blood or was it Quirrell? Thank you for a great podcast. I love you. You make my day."

Eric: That's actually my mistake, or kind of mistake. 'Cause we were talking about - somehow we got onto the topic of Voldemort, and, you know, the drinking of the unicorn's blood, to see if that was ever going to play out in the books, and I said it didn't, but I think she's right here that it was, you know, it was basically Quirrell who drank the blood and - and, you know, it doesn't have to be - therefore, it's not really a book mistake at all. It's just, you know, it's less likely that Voldemort would have to carry that burden around.

Matt: Yeah.

Laura: Mmm.

Matt: And it's a movie mistake on my part. I was going based off of the movie and - 'cause it seemed like in the movie it was a spirit that attacked Harry, because it was just floating.

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: And we know that Quirrell's a body and also the - the cloaked figure in the movie flew away, and we know that only Voldemort knows how to fly by himself. So that's why I thought it was Voldemort.

Micah: And then - yeah, there was one thing I screwed up last week, too, that a bunch of people wrote in about, and it was in reference to the Horcruxes and the number that Harry should have realized, but actually when he had the conversation with Dumbledore in Half-Blood Prince - as a bunch of people pointed out, Dumbledore only mentioned there being six and that the seventh piece resided in Voldemort, and that Voldemort himself was unaware that he had made Harry a Horcrux as well at that point. So that was my mistake.

Chapter-by-Chapter: Chapter 28, "The Missing Mirror"

Andrew: Woopsies. So it's time to move on to Chapter-by-Chapter. This week we're going to talk about Chapter 28, "The Missing Mirror." It's another...

Matt: Gosh, 28 already?

Andrew: Yeah. It's another relatively short chapter, but it's really exciting, and this is a really - another really big movie chapter I think. This whole book is just fantastically written for the movie. So do we want to start with a short little summary? I thought as a fun game what we could start doing is doing like a five second summary. So who's ever doing the short summary this week you have to do it in five seconds.

Micah: Five seconds. All right, that's...

Laura: Okay.

Matt: Kind of intense.

Micah: ...almost impossible.

Laura: I think you could do it.

Andrew: I think it's possible.

Eric: Yeah, okay, I'll take that bait, Andrew.

Laura: I think you could do it.

Andrew: All right, Eric, all right. On three, ready? 1, 2, 3. Go.

Eric: Alarm, alarm! Potter! He's here! He's here! I was puttin' the cat out, you numbskulls!

[Andrew and Laura laugh]

Andrew: Wow.

Micah: [laughs] That was pretty good.

Andrew: That was exactly what I was thinking.

Matt: That was so reminiscent the Pirates of the Caribbean ride at Disney Land.

Andrew: That was exactly five seconds, too. All right, Eric. Good job!

Eric: Sheista. That's like - remember that - what was that segment where I had to improvise something?

Andrew: And you did that same thing?

Eric: Yeah, that was - no, no, that was...

Andrew: That was a short summary, too.

Eric: Huh. I'm just kind of freaking out. That was really intense. Okay. I'm better.

Andrew: Yeah. Are you okay? You...

Eric: Yeah, I'm good. I'm just, you know...

Andrew: your high?

Eric: Heart racing and stuff.

Andrew: Take a drink of water.

Laura: I've got an inhaler, Eric, if you need it.

Matt: Do you need to sit down?

Eric: Yeah, I'm going to get a drink, actually, but, no, I'm not going to over milk it. Actually, could you cut out all of this that's just milking it and milking it?

Andrew: Yes.

Eric: Thank you for your appreciation. I'm going to get a drink. I'll be right back.

Andrew: [laughs] Okay. He actually hurt himself, I think.

[Andrew, Laura, and Micah laugh]

Andrew: All right. So they go into Hogsmeade and immediately there's a deafening scream of alarm sounds and it's just chaos right from the start of the chapter, right, Matt?

Matt: Oh, yeah! It's - everything's going horribly wrong already, so, you know, they're like, "Oh crap."

You Can't "Accio" the Cloak

Andrew: And they think they got them. One of the Death Eaters goes, "Accio Cloak" hoping it comes off, but why doesn't it come off? Is it - is there - does anyone know why?

Matt: It's a magical object...

Laura: Yeah...

Matt: It's an actual invisibility cloak that no magic can...

Micah: The Invisibility Cloak.

Laura: Yeah, it's not like...

Andrew: So is that why can't it be taken, Laura?

Laura: I think so, because they were talking about how this one was particularly unique, because they mention something about there being other invisibility cloaks made, but over time they would fade...

Andrew: Oh, right.

Micah: Right.

Laura: And they wouldn't maintain the same power that this one had. But I think this one was made from such properties that it couldn't be affected.

Matt: And this is old magic, too.

Laura: Mhm.

Matt: I mean, this is ancient, you know, beginning of the wizarding world, I guess.

Eric: It's not even necessarily old magic. I mean, it's Death's - I'm sorry - the fairy tale describes it as Death's invisibility cloak. It's how death hid from people, you know, until it was time to kill them. So, it might not even be magic at all. I mean, obviously it is, but it could be something with life and death, far more mystical.

Matt: It's like a neutral thing. Like, it's a tool.

Eric: Yeah. If it's Death's invisibility cloak, it's not something human enchanted or demiguise or anything like that. It's much more powerful.

Matt: I guess we could just call it like a shield against magic, too.

Andrew: "Now Accio free! Whoa!"

Matt: Well, you wonder if it doesn't work on Accio, maybe if like a spell hits them it bounces off or doesn't affect them?

Eric: I don't know! Actually, I think J.K.R should write about that because I always wondered, well - as they get older and taller, and, you know, their feet slip out from underneath and stuff, couldn't they cast Engorgio on the invisibility cloak or, you know, do some kind of modification to make it bigger? You know, that's a good question, I guess, because this spell repelled off them.

Matt: Exactly.

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Well, it didn't even repel. I think it just - it's almost like they don't even exist. So it's probably not even - I don't really know how to get anymore into it than what was already said.

Eric: Remember when Dumbledore and Harry were in the lake - sorry, the underground lake thing - sorry, the cave - when Dumbledore and Harry are in the cave and Harry says, "Accio Horcrux," and something happens. Nothing really happens, but, you know, something jumps out of the lake, that sort of thing. In this case nothing happened at all. The cloak is basically unsummonable.

Matt: It's untraceable, too. But didn't the Mad-Eye Moody impostor know? And didn't Dumbledore know...

Eric: Oh, that's right!

Matt: ...that Harry and Ron were hiding under the cloak?

Eric: The Marauder's Map can detect people no matter if they're under that cloak or not. Interesting.

Micah: I was always under the impression that the reason the impostor Moody knew he was there was because he got stuck in the step. And you remember that?

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: Yeah.

Matt: Yeah, yeah, I do.

Laura: Yeah, he got stuck in the step and he dropped the egg.

Micah: I think Dumbledore is just powerful. I mean, that's what it comes down to and he just - maybe because he was so into the Hallows he was aware when it was being used around him. I mean, I don't know.

Matt: Yeah, I mean he's had it the entire time too.

Eric: He's had time to examine it, and several times throughout the books Harry believed that Dumbledore could see through the cloak, even which we don't know if that's true, but...

Micah: Possible, but also remember he knew that Harry had the cloak to begin with.

Eric: He gave it to him.

Micah: Yeah. So - and he knew the type of person that Harry was in the sense of always sneaking out, so when he's in Hagrid's hut, the minister shows up with Lucius Malfoy. I mean, I just have a feeling that Dumbledore knew a whole lot more than he let on.

Andrew: Oh, yeah.

Matt: Oh, definitely.

Getting Rescued by Aberforth

Andrew: So anyway, chaos is erupting in Hogsmeade, and it's a really action packed scene. They're trying to reveal Harry, Ron, and Hermione, and then it's just, you know, one of those things. I guess maybe it was a panic reaction, but Aberforth - without knowing it's Aberforth - they're called into - they go into this dark corner and Aberforth says, "Come in here, Potter, quick." And they don't even know it's Aberforth. So my question is, why would they trust someone when they hear that? Is it just like the immediate reaction?

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: You're just looking for...

Matt: Well, yeah. I think it's definitely just like an impulse.

Laura: Yeah.

Eric: Look at the alternatives.

Andrew: But wouldn't the Death Eaters be smart enough - couldn't they have been smart enough to set a trap up like that where there's people waiting in the depths of...

Eric: If they were, Andrew...

Laura: Maybe they did and they just got lucky.

Andrew: I know they just got lucky, but just for argument's sake, I just think it's...

Eric: Well, for argument's sake, Andrew, I mean, if you want to look at it, if a Death Eater was smart enough - I mean, there's 50 Death Eaters coming at you from directions saying, "The alarm, it was over here, I saw him, he's here!", and then somebody opens the door and says "Quick, get in," you know - if that was a Death Eater they deserve to get caught, because, I mean, the whole deal is, you know, it's not just even instinct. It's just, you know - it's so starkly contrasting to anything anyone else is doing. If someone says, "Get in" I would trust it no matter what. Implicitly and wholly, and, you know, if it turned out to be a Death Eater, that would be unfortunate.

Matt: So after Harry and the other two go into - they find out it's the Hog's Head that they're inside and that they hear the voice say, "Keep your cloak on, boy," and I thought that was pretty reminiscent of Dumbledore in Half-Blood Prince when he kept telling Harry to keep his cloak on.

Andrew: Yeah. It could be a cute little throwback.

Eric: And after all, he is Dumbledore's brother.

Andrew: Well, yeah, exactly.

Eric: It's revealed almost as soon as they get in here, even the namesake of the chapter "The Missing Mirror" - Harry discovers that Aberforth has the mirror, which was Sirius'. The other half - or I'm sorry, the copy - the other partner of the mirror that Harry had and, you know, consequently broke. The mirror which he has been seeing a blue eye that he thought was Albus Dumbledore's, and, in fact, it's Aberforth, his brother's, Dumbledore's. So I thought that was an awesome connection, that, in fact, he's had this overlying confusion about Dumbledore and whether or not he's even dead, and really he's just been seeing Aberforth, and that's really cool.

Andrew: So, really, Harry was right.

Matt: He did see Dumbledore, it just wasn't Albus.

Andrew: Right.

Aberforth versus Death Eaters

Matt: Right. So, we see Aberforth going out of the Hog's Head to argue with the Death Eaters for...

Andrew: God, I loved this.

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: This was really fun. It's almost like one of those old geezers across the street or something who, like, yell at the kids to get off their lawn.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: This is the part I'm talking about, just for the movies, because his comebacks are so quick. It's almost like he thought about this, even though it was very unexpected - Aberforth wasn't expecting them at all. I mean, he had to think really fast on his feet to come up with these. And he lucked out that it turns out his Patronus is a goat, and he was convincing the Death Eaters that the Patronus that was actually sent to fight off the Death Eaters was actually a goat, even though it was Harry's.

Matt: Yeah. Well - and Aberforth, he was threatening the Death Eaters, too.

Andrew: Yeah, he was.

Matt: I mean...

Andrew: I'm surprised at that, because why didn't they just kill him?

Eric: Well...

Matt: Because he knew he was - he knew he was useful to them. I mean, they needed Aberforth. They needed the Hog's Head. They - because, you know, that's how they get fed.

Andrew: Oh, yeah that's true.

Laura: Mhm.

Eric: And it's the passageway to Hogwarts. Well, no. But they didn't know they were going to get fed when they entered the room either. But, I mean, there's a question, and rightly here, it says that, you know, were the Death Eaters - actually, I should stop calling it the rightly, because Google bought it about three years ago, but it asks if the Death Eaters were a little too thick to believe Aberforth, but, you know, they seem to dismiss the whole situation pretty quickly, but I think as Aberforth, you know, he knew what to threaten and, you know, he basically said, "Why don't you call your Dark Lord here and, you know, answer to him when it turns out not to be Potter." You know, he's really sly, really quick, really, you know, kind of pressing and really working with their emotions. He's - he's kind of a manipulator. At least a little bit, and he's not that unlike his brother, I guess, in that way. I mean, you know, varying degrees, but I liked that scene a lot.

Matt: Mhm.

Laura: Mhm.

Matt: Yeah. And Aberforth is really giving them excuses that were really, you know, very simple and, you know, unimportant that if, you know, they did call Voldemort and it turned out to be true, you know, the Death Eaters would get a real lashing for it. Like he was walking his cat. Like, they called Voldemort because they heard - because they thought Potter was here but it was really someone walking their cat.

Andrew: But if they actually did call Voldemort, wouldn't Voldemort be able to tell that Harry was in the area?

Eric: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Andrew: Yeah, so, like, what would happen if the Death Eaters actually did call him? What would Aberforth think?

Micah: It's such a huge risk, though.

Laura: He would have been screwed.

Micah: I think...

Eric: Yeah. Their orders are...

Matt: They would not call Voldemort unless they had concrete evidence.

Micah: If you think about what happened at Gringott's...

[Eric laughs]

Matt: Everybody died except Bellatrix and...

Actor to Play Aberforth

Micah: You need to be a little bit smarter, I think. You know, I could actually see Brendon Gleason doing a really good job as Aberforth in this part.

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: Brendon Gleason?

Micah: Yeah.

Eric: He played Mad-Eye Moody.

Andrew: Yes. It'd be cool, though.

Micah: Really? [laughs] I had no idea.

Eric: I thought you said they cast him as Aberforth or whatever, but...

Micah: No, no I'm saying...

Eric: could see him as Mad-Eye Moody.

Micah: I could see him playing this role.

Eric: Okay.

Micah: Forgetting he would have played Mad-Eye Moody already, I could see him, sort of, as the old man, you know, like Matt was saying before, kind of "Get off my lawn," you know.

Eric: I think - I think I was trying to - I mean, I think I made that connection without even thinking about it. You really brought it out. He does remind me of him.

Andrew: You know who else could be good? Maybe this is pushing it a little too, and he's dead, so that would be even worse, but Peter Doyle. He's sort of cranky. And he's not big enough, that's for sure.

Matt: Do you think they're going to keep the same actor?

Eric: They should.

Andrew: No. No way.

Eric: Why not?

Andrew: Why wouldn't they keep him?

Eric: David Yates is keeping himself as director, and the same musical composer, and all the actors are still...

Andrew: When they cast this guy to play Aberforth, they just needed a...

Micah: Stand-in.

Andrew: A figure.

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: They needed an illustration, so to speak. They didn't need a...

Matt: For this big a character, they're going to have to get a well-known actor.

Eric: I don't know about that. How many more well-known actors are there?

Andrew: I don't think he's that big of a character.

Matt: Well, I don't know, because he has a fore - I mean, he has a - they had Julie Christie playing Madame Rosemerta, and she was only in one scene, and Julie Christie is a huge actress.

Laura: Yeah. They tend to cast very major actors and actresses in these adult roles, no matter how small they are.

Matt: Yeah. I would not be surprised if they cast a very distinguished actor to play Aberforth Dumbledore.

Eric: Who's to say they haven't already? Who played him in Order of the Phoenix, do you know?

Matt: No, I don't. That's the point.

Andrew: I'm looking it up right now. I really don't think it was a well-known guy. He's not even listed.

Matt: Because he barely had one line, and it was in the background.

Andrew: He's credited - Jim McManus is who plays Aberforth, and he's credited as the Barman. He's not even credited as Aberforth.

Micah: Yeah, I was going to say that. I didn't think he was credited because I did a search on IMDB for Aberforth Dumbledore, which you can usually do by character. Nothing came up, so that should be a little bit of a hint right there that - unless it was more of a they didn't want anybody to know yet, because they're kind of following the books in the sense that nobody really knows that that's Aberforth.

Andrew: Yeah, well, that's true, too.

Eric: Yeah, he isn't really Aberforth yet, you're right, but, you know, all the diehard fans would see this goat and Aberforth walking after it. It was hilarious and it was, you know, one of those really funny things that I liked about Movie 5. Jim McManus has lots of extensive credits here, running back down to...

Andrew: But they're all - I'm looking at them too, and they're all T.V. shows.

Eric: That doesn't mean he can't act.

Andrew: I think Order of the Phoenix is his first movie.

Eric: Hm, that's true.

Andrew: I see one movie here; he played a chef. And another...

Eric: And Mr. Critchley in Dangerous Lady.

Andrew: And he played something in Machine.

Matt: Yeah. Yeah, it has to be a more distinguished actor to play the - I mean, they have yet to - he's going to be telling the story of what happened to his family - the Dumbledore family.

Andrew: Back to Chapter-by-Chapter. [laughs] Another question Matt raises is, can Michael Gambon be a better Aberforth than Dumbledore?

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: I think that, you know...

Eric: Too late, Matt.

Andrew: That's not a bad - yeah, it is too late, but that's not a bad idea because he is so cranky.

Matt: Well, yeah, he is a feisty Dumbledore, and we see Aberforth as more of the cranky, more, I guess you could say, emotional of the two brothers.

Michael Gambon

Laura: I guess. I mean, you know I'm going to disagree with this because I love Michael Gambon, but I don't particularly see him as playing a cranky Dumbledore. And I know Micah's going to come out and like, try to take a lash at me for this: there were definitely some lines where he came across as cranky, but that's not Gambon's fault. He didn't write the script, and I think, overall, he's played a very quirky, very interesting Dumbledore character. I really see the twinkle in his eye.

[Andrew laughs]

Laura: That's what they talk about in the books! And that's what I see!

Matt: That's just bad lighting, Laura.

Micah: It's probably his glazed over look from not knowing how to act.

[Everyone laughs]

Eric: Laura, I would agree with you in Movie 5. I was impressed with Gambon in Movie 5.

Matt: The only thing I did not like of his acting was when he said, "Don't you all have studying to do?"

Eric: Yeah, that was just the wrong line.

Laura: But again, that's not his fault! He didn't write the script.

Micah: I'll say this - and it's been brought up every single time I think we've had this conversation - is that when the role is initiated by another actor, it's very hard to replace, regardless, and it's just like you look at any of your favorite T.V. shows, if so-and-so plays the role for "X" number of years and then all of a sudden they bring in somebody else...

Eric: Yeah.

Micah: know, you have a much higher level of opinion of the person that they bring in because they have to meet certain expectations.

Andrew: So back on the Chapter-by-Chapter...

[Laura laughs]

Andrew: ...we learn a couple of things from Aberforth: one that Hagrid and Grawp are hiding in a cave, and we also learn that Dobby - we learn that Aberforth was the one who sent Dobby.

Eric: Right.

Andrew: And Aberforth was saddened to hear that Dobby died, because he said that he liked him.

Eric: He liked that elf.

Hagrid in Hiding

Andrew: Which was a sort of sad little moment there, but, I mean, do we want to talk about Hagrid? Has - has he been in seclusion the whole time? I mean, Aberforth himself said that he went to hide as soon as...

Eric: Well, he threw a party. A "Support Harry" party.

Andrew: They were searching for him.

Matt: At least we know where Hagrid is, though. I mean, 'cause - I don't know about you guys, but I never even thought about Hagrid very much until he was mentioned at this part of the book.

Andrew: I did, because I was hoping to see him.

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: I love Hagrid.

Matt: Well, I love Hagrid, too, but I mean - I was - I was in the heat of the moment when I was reading the book.

Eric: Well, you know what's interesting...

Matt: I never stopped to go, "Where's Hagrid?"

Eric: You know what's interesting, though, I think the cave there...

Andrew: I did.

Eric: ...was the same cave Sirius was in. Do you remember that one, when - in Book 4.

Andrew: How do you know it's the same cave?

Eric: Well, I mean, there's a cave on a hill outside of Hogsmeade, you know, I just assumed that it was the same one that Sirius had hid in - you know, the trio even went to that cave in Book 4. Do you guys remember that?

Matt: Yeah.

Laura: Yeah.

Matt: When they were visiting Hogsmeade.

Laura: I think you're right. I feel like at some point - [sighs] - didn't Hagrid hide there at some other point, too? Or didn't he hide something there?

Matt: Yeah, after Book 5, wasn't it? When he ran away?

Laura: Yeah, and I feel like he said it was the same cave Sirius hid in, so...

Matt: It's possible, I mean...

Laura: It could be the same one again.

Matt: Heck, why not? You know?

Eric: [laughs] Why not? I mean, it just seems like one of those things Jo would do. "Oh, he's hiding in a cave over the hill." You know, that sort of thing.

Matt: [laughs] Let's just throw him in a cave.

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