Hermione's Patronus

Laura: Why do you guys think, why do you think her Patronus is an otter? I’ve always been curious about that. What personality traits do you think that she exhibits that would make her Patronus an otter?

Jamie: Can I go?

Laura: Yeah.

Jamie: I think she’s, I’m going to be really, really boring and just say that Jo thought that Hermione should have an otter. It sounded nice and it just sort of - I can just picture Hermione waving her wand and this otter just sort of flapping about on the ground, walking along. Well she like turns her head talking seriously to Harry. Just picture it.

[Laura laughs]

Ben: I don’t know. Jamie, I think I might have to agree with you there. Like we’ve said in the past, we overanalyze things - well, you guys know what I mean.

Jamie: Yeah.

Ben: But I don’t if the whole otter thing, if there is really a hidden meaning behind it. Maybe it’s an otter for just for the sake of being an otter.

Jamie: I don’t know.

Laura: No, no, no. I’m talking personality traits and such.

Jamie: I don’t really know how an otter behaves though. Are otters angry or...?

Laura: We don’t know terribly much about Hermione’s background.

Andrew: Didn’t, okay, you guys are going to think I’m crazy, but didn’t JK Rowling… I’m going to look this up right now. Didn’t JK Rowling say she…

Laura: I know she said something…

Andrew: She liked otters as one of her favorite animals?

Laura: Yeah. It seems like that and she always talks about how Hermione was like her.

Andrew: Yeah, exactly.

Jamie: Yeah, that could be it.

Andrew: So, yeah.

Micah: I know I’m not a scientist or anything but isn’t there a relation between an otter and a weasel, somewhere along the line?

Jamie: Is there? Oh my god.

Laura: That makes sense.

Jamie: Oh my god, that’s amazing! Oh my god.

Ben: Oh my god.

Jamie: Oh my god, Micah, that’s absolutely awesome.

Ben: Oh my god. Micah Tannenbaum has discovered the key to the Harry Potter shipping series. Do you guys see this?

[All laugh]

Ben: Fans, send a letter to the P.O. Box.

Andrew: Give us a call.

[All still laughing]

Ben: Send him fanmail. Give us a call. Oh my gosh, Micah.

Andrew: 218-20-MAGIC. Seriously though, he makes a good point.

Jamie: That's an awesome point.

Ben: That is true, that is true.

Micah: Now I’m going to have to look that up.

Andrew: I’m going to do Google image searches and compare.

Jamie: Can we have ten seconds of silence to appreciate that amazing revelation by Micah?

Andrew: [digusted noise] Nobody Google image search weasel. I’m sorry I mentioned that.

[All laugh]

Jamie: Really? I’m doing it right now of course.

Ben: So Micah, yeah, Micah, that’s a very ingenious theory, I’m impressed. Do you have something else to add about it? You’re on to something here. I think you are.

Andrew: You have pioneered this new shipping theory.

Micah: Yeah, here. Ok, wait this is…

Laura: Ah, the shippers are going to be…

Micah: This is on the BigBlueBus.com [laughs].

Andrew: We’re going to hear this on the Harmony PodCast.

Micah: Yeah. Sea otters may be similar to seals on the outside, but they are not closely related. Sea otters are related to the weasel family…

Jamie: Yay.

Micah: But they share the sea with the seals.

Jamie: Yay, yay, yay, yay, yay.

Ben: Micah, Micah. Are you JK Rowling?

Micah: I am.

[All laugh]

Ben: Yeah, I swear. Listen to this kid.

Jamie: Didn’t you know that, Ben? Didn’t you know that? Of course he is.

Ben: Yeah, I was just on Skype with Jo the other day.

Jamie: Did he catch you in the dark?

Andrew: Yeah.

Micah: You mean me?

Andrew: Don’t steal John’s jokes. They are bad enough as they are.

Micah: Who’s John?

Ben: Do you guys think there is any question that Hermione is going to end up with Ron?

Jamie: Uhh, no. Although, although…

Andrew: At this point…

Laura: Any question that Hermione will end up with Ron? No.

Jamie: I have this horrible feeling that, no I don’t think it is, but I can see it happening, being some kind of tragedy. Like they’ll admit their undying love to each other just as Ron dies. I hope it isn’t going to end like that and I don’t think Jo would do that to us actually. But, you never know.

Andrew: I don’t know.

Jamie: Romeo and Juliet.

Ben: The problem I see occurring is that Ron is too big of a - what’s the word I am looking for…he’s a chicken.

Laura: No he’s not.

Andrew: Yes he is, he always has been.

Ben: Yes he is. He’s scared of spiders, he’s afraid of talking to girls…

Laura: He is not.

Ben: The only time he’s asked a girl out is Fleur when he was hypnotized by Fleur’s Veela... viva jazz…whatever it’s called.

Laura: You know what. If Ron were a coward, he would not have done half of the things he’s done with Harry. He would not.

Ben: No, he’s a coward when it comes to girls. That’s what I’m saying. When it comes to girls…

Laura: Well, yeah, so is Harry.

Ben: I know, but I’m saying that, how is Ron suppose to reveal his undying love for Hermione when he can’t even ask her to the Yule Ball?

Laura: Okay, half the guys on the planet are terrified of girls - they get over it.

Ben: Not true, not true.

Laura: Yeah, true.

Ben: I’m not. You guys hear me talking about Emma. I’m not terrified of anyone. I’m Ben Schoen.

Laura: Right, well we’ll get you face-to-face with Emma and see what happens.

Andrew: Yeah.

Ben: Oh, nothing will happen. But the point I’m trying to make is, the only reason I don’t see the relationship happening right away is because the whole…

Laura: Well of course it hasn’t happened right away, it’s been six years.

Ben: I’m talking about Book 7, when we get into Book 7.

Laura: No, it’s not going to be straight off and I don’t even think we’re going to see that much of it.

Ben: They have other things to worry about. [laughs]

Laura: Yeah, exactly. I think if both of them live, which I think it’s very possible that Ron’s going to die, but if they both live, that they’re going to get together at the very end. And then she said she was going to write an epilogue letting us know what happened to everyone. So if they grow up and get married and have loads of kids, then we’ll find out. But it’s not going to be a huge part of the storyline.

Ben: Definitely true.

Jamie: I have something to talk about. Can we talk about something?

Ben: Yes.

Harry's Life Post-Voldemort

Jamie: Ok, I think we should discuss whether Harry, if he kills Voldemort, whether he can have a quiet life after Book 7 or whether he will always be living in the shadow of being Harry Potter and defeating Voldemort. He can like get married, settle down, and have children and live a normal life, or can’t he? Take the floor, somebody.

Laura: I think he could get married and he could have kids and stuff, but I don’t think his life will ever be normal.

Jamie: No, I agree. Yeah.

Laura: I think it’s always going to be there.

Ben: It’s kind of like, what's the word I am looking for when actors are always known, like Mark Hamill. Luke Skywalker.

Jamie: Yeah.

Ben: He’s always like, whenever you see a movie, you’re like "Hey, that’s Luke Skywalker" and some people think the same things going to happen to Daniel Radcliffe. People will say, "Oh, what is Harry Potter doing in the movie?"

Laura: It’s entirely possible.

Andrew: Well I mean like, when you say living a normal life, do you mean not being recognized on the streets and stuff like that? Cause if he kills Voldemort…

Ben: No, no, no.

Andrew: He won’t have to worry about that anymore. So in that sense, he won’t be constantly having this on his mind and his scar won’t burn and all that. But I think he’ll lead a normal life if it’ll just be, "Oh, you’re Harry Potter. You’re that guy, cool."

Ben: No, look at it after, before, look at it before Voldemort came back. When Harry, whenever he got on the train, everyone was trying to look at his scar. Whatever battle scars he has from Voldemort, if he survives the final battle, then it’s going to end up the same way. They are going to say, "Well, does he have a new scar? Does he have this, or does he have…?"

Andrew: Yeah. Well, it’s just getting recognized.

Laura: Not to mention, there is always going to be a little bit fear there, I think. People are always going to have that little bit of fear about Harry being powerful enough to...

Jamie: Yeah.

Laura: ...defeat Voldemort. I mean, there is a possibility he could possibly rise up and be the same thing.

Jamie: The thing is though, he’s like more than famous. It isn’t just fame, he isn’t like a celebrity. He’s like, you know, I can’t think of a word for it but, I think it extends beyond, "Oh hey, you’re somebody, can I have your autograph," it’s just...

Ben: He’s a phenom. Is that a real word, a phenom?

Jamie: Don’t know.

Ben: Phenom?

Andrew: Phenomenon?

Ben: Not a phenomenon, a phenom. Is that a word, phenom?

Andrew: Female? Are you calling Harry a girl?

Jamie: [laughs] Sounds like a type of water.

Micah: I think it’s short for phenomenon. I think you’re good. Don’t worry about it.

Ben: It’s a phenomenon: Especially remarkable or an outstanding person. Yeah, Harry Potter's a phenom...

Micah: There you go.

Ben: ...in the wizarding world. I found a word for it. Okay, guys, is there anything more to add about Hermione?

Andrew: Yes, there’s plenty to add.

Ben: Well then, tell me something. Tell me something good about her.

Andrew: I just can’t think of it, I don’t know. See...

Hermione and Draco

Ben: [whispers] She’s a Mudblood.

Andrew: Yeah, why was she so hurt when Draco said that to her?

Laura: She wasn’t in the book. In the book…

Ben: Yes, she was in the book.

Laura: No, she didn’t know what it was.

Ben: Yeah, she didn’t know what it was. She was like, "What’s a Mudblood?"

Jamie: Oh yeah, she just didn’t know what it was.

Ben: It’s because Ron reacted. In the movie, she’s like [makes crying noises], "It means dirty blood."

Jamie: Why is Draco so obsessed with Hermione being a Mudblood as well? Think how many…

Andrew: Yeah.

Jamie: Oh, I shouldn’t say that word so rudely, but think how many of them there are at Hogwarts. Although the dialogue centers around Harry and his group of friends, still you’d expect him to concentrate on all of them, not just Hermione specifically. Oh, perhaps he has a thing for her.

Ben: Ooooh.

Andrew: I just…

Ben: A love/hate thing.

Laura: I think he’s threatened by her. I think he feels very threatened by her. Like as we saw in Chamber of Secrets…

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: When Lucius was getting on to him about having lower exam results than her.

Andrew: Exactly.

Ben: Yep.

Laura: And on top of that, she’s Harry’s best friend. I think he’s extremely threatened by her.

Andrew: I think it’s Lucius that’s drilling it into Draco’s mind.

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: "That you cannot, you have to hate this girl. She’s not wizard-born. Are you kidding me?" Stuff like that. It’s all how they’re raised.

Ben: I agree with you, dude.

Emma Watson as Hermione Granger

Andrew: How about we talk about Emma for a little bit because Emma in the... Okay, Hermione in the movies is portrayed differently than she really is in the books. Mostly her looks. That rhymed.

Ben: Oh yeah.

Laura: Yeah.

Andrew: Ben likes these looks.

Ben: Well, obviously you do, too. You were confusing her. You were calling Hermione Emma and Emma Hermione.

Andrew: I’m just trying to be mature, Ben. I’m going to hold my personalized thoughts to myself.

Ben: That’s alright, I love you. Emma, if you’re listening to this, I love you.

Andrew: Okay.

Laura: Ben, shut-up!

Andrew: She - just - in the movies, she looks like a beauty queen, which is completely wrong.

Laura: She does. I think…

Andrew: Laura, elaborate.

Laura: It is, it really is. The Yule Ball scene was supposed to be a complete transformation.

Jamie: Yeah, that’s a good point.

Laura: And I don’t know about you guys, but as I was looking at the screen, I didn’t see any difference except for the fact that she was wearing a dress. And she had on earrings.

Jamie: And her hair was up, yeah.

Laura: Yeah, her hair was up. And there was just no…it wasn’t stunning. It really wasn’t because we see her as this more than average-looking girl. She’s prettier than most of the girls that she’s on screen with and not that Emma isn’t pretty, because she is very pretty, but…

Ben: Got that right.

Laura: I think they could do a better job of dressing her down.

Andrew: Well, they don’t even try because they want to make Emma look good so that all the guys are interested in seeing the films.

Laura: It’s sex appeal.

Andrew: Yeah. I just, I can’t even mention the things my friends said in school the other day.

[Laughing]

Jamie: I’ve heard this story.

Ben: I’d probably agree with many of those things.

Laura: We can’t mention some of the things that Ben has said…

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: ...when we’re not recording.

[Laughing]

Jamie: Don’t you think this comes down to, do you think the books - sorry - do you think the films should mirror the books? Because, you know, there are so many things…

Andrew: That’s the important that that people are upset by.

Jamie: But...

Andrew: Most - a good portion of the fan base consists of girls, and they have this Emma in the movie looking very nice.

Ben: Mighty fine.

Andrew: [laughs] I was waiting for that.

Laura: The reason that it bothers so many girls is because girls look to Hermione as a type of role model.

Andrew: Yeah.

Laura: They see her as someone who has a great amount of power in the series, but she’s not any, what’s the best way to put this…

Andrew: A slut.

Laura: She’s average. Yeah exactly, she’s someone you can identify with, on several levels, and when you see her as someone who is just physically perfect. It’s just…It kind of kills the image.

Ben: And it’s weird that how in the movie when Emma, or Hermione, said the line, [in a horrible British accent] "It’s taken you this long, maybe you should notice I’m a girl" and all this stuff then…

Jamie: Was that suppose to be a British accent, Ben? That was absolutely atrocious…

Ben: It was a poor attempt.

Jamie: Pitiful.

Ben: But when Emma said the line about "Well, Ron, maybe you should notice I’m a girl next time," then I kind of think, well how can he not notice? Look how good she looks.

Laura: Exactly.

Ben: Because in the books, I think the attraction is more of a - more of a, you know - they’re attracted to personalities as opposed to…

Laura: Yeah, not to mention Ron doesn’t know it. He’s clueless.

Ben: Definitely true, but I think Emma does a really good job portraying the personality I think.

Jamie: Yeah, I agree.

Ben: I think it’s just the problem - they prettied her up so much.

Laura: She’s a good actress. She’s a great actress. I think she’s doing a good job, really.

Ben: And another thing that I noticed is that, ever since the first, movie they started making her better and better. I don’t know if it has to do anything with her maturing…

Andrew: It’s just her age. She was eleven when she started.

Jamie: It’s maturity.

Ben: But seriously though, look at the first movie. Look at her hair, though. It’s all frizzy and puffied out.

Laura: Yeah, it was perfect in the first one.

Ben: And then second movie, it was just kind of long and curly. Third movie, it was just sort of there; it wasn’t even trademark Hermione hair anymore. Then in the fourth movie, it was somewhat straight half the time.

Andrew: But we know why they do this. It’s for marketing. A lot of this…

Jamie: No, it’s...

Andrew: Yes, it is.

Jamie: No, it’s not. It’s because people change and the description that Jo gave at the beginning of the first book - she‘s not going to describe the characters in every subsequent book. People in this world change their hairstyles, they change their clothes, they change everything. You can’t expect Hermione to look exactly the same. Obviously, you know it is true that she is pretty different from the books, but she‘s changed and she’s matured just as Hermione in the books has.

Micah: But, I mean, are we going to see like a Luna Lovegood supermodel in the next movie?

Andrew: Yeah.

Jamie: Uhhh...

Laura: That’s what I’m afraid of.

Andrew: Well, we’ll find out in January.

Laura: The thing is I agree with Jamie to a certain extent, but the thing is, Hermione has never put a great deal of time into her appearance…

Ben: Until the Yule Ball.

Laura: The only time we see that is for the Yule Ball, and even after that, she never - there is no description of her ever. She even said so herself, trying to make her hair straight, she just wasn’t going to do it again. It was too much of a hassle.

Andrew: Yeah, and I’m sure, I’m sure, that JK Rowling has intended it that way, to not look all fancy.

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: She’s smart, she’s doesn’t care about looks.

Jamie: But she does though, obviously. That…

Andrew: Well, she might now.

Jamie: No, no, no, but she does. The Yule Ball just proves everything, all of that. It all came together and she clearly does, and everyone thought before then that she just was obsessed with doing well in school and everything. But it turns out that she was a normal girl. Which means that, to be honest you know, the film producers can show that she cares about her looks because after you’ve read Book 4, you realize that.

Laura: I think she does and I think she is a normal girl to a certain extent, but I think she also realizes there are more important things that she has to do...

Jamie: Definitely, yeah.

Laura: ...other than put on lipstick.

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: But Jamie, you have to think that it has to do somewhat with marketing.

Jamie: Oh yeah, no, no. I do, of course, you can’t - I think the Trio has to...

Andrew: It has to sell.

Jamie: Yeah, Warner Bros. has to sell the Trio not only in the film, but outside the film. And, you know, you can’t always stay true to the book. But yeah, I think it’s partly to do with marketing, I wouldn’t say it’s completely to do with it. They do have to pick people who fit the roles in the real world as well as in the films. I mean, even if there was the most perfect Hermione who hated fame and hated all the publicity and PR stuff, you couldn’t pick her because she would suit the franchise. I think you have to pick actors who suit the franchise as well as the interior of the film.

Ben: [In a British accent] Very good point, mate.

Jamie: [In an American accent] Cheers, man.

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