MuggleCast 212 Transcript (continued)
News: Deathly Hallows Rating
Micah: That's not terrible, that's pretty long. I think we should just be happy with it and move on and expect that Part II will be longer. I mean I would hope that with everything that they have to do, the loose ends they have to tie up that we were promised that a majority of that film is going to be the battle that we should just be happy with this and I'm sure it will be fine. This next news item, I don't really know much about. It says the MPAA, the Motion Pictures Association of America, added "sensuality" as to why the movie here in the United States received a PG-13 rating and supposedly our site made a big deal about this, Andrew?
Andrew: Well you know lately I've been in the mood to write some link bait news posts. No, I'm kidding, the thing is, it was interesting because we've talked a lot about the MPAA here on MuggleCast. One of our listeners even recommended that I watch a documentary on the MPAA.
Eric: This Film Is Not Yet Rated?
Andrew: Right, great documentary, it really exposes them. But anyway, they issued the PG-13 rating a couple of weeks ago and then just the other day they revised their rating. They added that the film includes a moment of brief sensuality and is it that big of a deal?
Eric: No. This is the text that you see at the bottom of the green screen in the trailer, before the trailer begins. This is what you see, "rated PG-13 for..."
Andrew: Actually technically, no, that's the rating for the trailer itself, not the film. You see that at the end. I'm sorry.
Eric: Oh, well...
Andrew: Yeah, yeah, fun to read.
Eric: I still feel as though this text will not appear anywhere significant and the changing of this text, correct me if I'm wrong, the changing of this text is almost to avoid some sort of lawsuit. I don't understand why it was changed and I don't understand...
Andrew: Yeah it's just weird that they added it two weeks after the fact. Why didn't they catch this the first time around?
Micah: I think the British are just so much better. They don't sugarcoat anything. They give it to you right as it is. They rated the film a 12A for their own reasons and of course that's the PG-13 equivalent.
Andrew: They didn't mention sensuality.
Micah: Yeah, sensuality, that's a bunch of fluff as far as I'm concerned.
Eric: Their description of Deathly Hallows, the BBFC, is even worse. It says "moderate fantasy violence and threat". Moderate? What is "extreme fantasy violence and threat" sound like?
Micah: But they're British. Eric, they're British. They have to make it sound nice, you know? That's what they do.
Eric: [in a terrible English accent] It's moderate!
Andrew: All right.
Eric: [accent] Little trepidation on the fantasy violence.
Micah: Look, when you have a snake eat somebody within the first ten minutes of the film, I think it should be rated at least PG-13. That's my own take on it.
Eric: Or - or 12A, as it were.
News: 2010 Podcast Awards
Andrew: And the final piece of news today, which is actually more of an announcement about something coming up. The 2010 Podcast Awards are quickly approaching. If you've been a long-time listener of the show, you know we try to get nominated in the Podcast Awards every year and for the years we've tried, we have and I think for each year that we've been nominated, we've also won thanks to the amazing support of you, the listener. So the 2010 Podcast Awards are coming up. Nominations will be opening on November 7th and this year we are trying to run in the "People's Choice" as well as the "Entertainment" category. So there's two categories we want to compete in this year. "People's Choice" and "Entertainment." So again the - the period for nominations will be opening on November 7th. We will post details on MuggleCast.com as well as on our Twitter and Facebook so you know exactly how to help us out. We hope you can help us. We'd love to win this year. It's a perfect time for us to compete in the Podcast Awards considering that the movie is just coming out, so keep an eye out for details about that soon and we'd really appreciate your support. The "People's Choice" award is the - the big award.
Andrew: That's the top gun.
Eric: It's the big award. We really try and push this voting and nomination not only because we've been successful in the past, everybody has really come together. But even five years down the road, you know, MuggleCast celebrated its fifth birthday just a few months ago, and you know, we're still producing what I know I feel is a quality show and you know, I know the three of us contribute to it greatly and still feel as though it's relevant.
Eric: And, you know, certainly one of the best things a listener can do for us if they feel the same is to support us at these Podcast Awards. You know, which are the creme de la creme or the big kahuna actually.
Micah: Yeah, and I think it's been overall, like Eric said, it's been a big year for us, you know, crossing that threshold of five years, 200 episodes, getting David Heyman and talking to him as well as Warwick Davis, he was also on the show this year so - obviously none of this could be done without the support of everybody out there who listens so, as Eric mentioned, you know, kind of the way you can give back to us is by helping us out here and going out to vote.
Eric: So, so...
Eric: Everybody who ever sent in a Chicken Soup, we have your name and your city so if you don't vote for us we will [laughs] we will find you.
Andrew: So that's it for news. Later on in the show we're going to be, of course, reading your e-mails and we're also going to do Dueling Club: Ghost Edition in honor of Halloween and also, recently, we asked on our Twitter if anyone's dressing up for Halloween in a Harry Potter costume, besides Eric, and we got some of your responses so we'll be reading those, too. But, for now, Chapter-By-Chapter. This week we're looking at Chapter 16 through 18 of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire. Micah's kicking us off with Chapter 16, "The Goblet of Fire," the title of the book.
Chapter-by-Chapter: "The Goblet of Fire"
Micah: How appropriate.
Micah: So, when we last left off, the students from Beauxbatons and Durmstrang had arrived. And the chapter begins with kind of a funny exchange between Ron and Hermione over Viktor Krum. And then they get into it a little bit when the Veela girl from Beauxbatons comes over and asks Ron for the French Bouillabaisse. And you can see a little bit of tension developing here. Do you guys notice that? And Ron clearly - he's enamored by Viktor Krum, but he's very much enamored, even more so, by who we later find out is Fleur Delacour.
Eric: Yeah, yeah. Ron is a little uncertain in who he likes to fangirl more.
Andrew: Teenage love.
Eric: But I think Viktor Krum - it's interesting because in these next few chapters we see a lot more Viktor Krum - or we see a fair amount of Viktor Krum. And he's described very often as being sulky, like in a corner and kind of a loner. And it's interesting that he has all of this attention, especially from guys like Ron, who are very rarely passionate about anything other than themselves. And he's got this hard-core dedication as being, you know, this distinction as being a great Quidditch player. So it's kind of interesting to see him act in these moments.
Micah: Yeah, and you can definitely see the jealousy start to develop a little bit on the part of Hermione, especially when Ron suggests that the girl must be part Veela, because he just can't seem to take his eyes off her, no matter what he does.
Eric: [laughs] Yeah.
Micah: Now, an interesting question here: does it say something when these two schools arrive that Durmstrang ends up sitting with Slytherin and Beauxbatons ends up sitting with Ravenclaw?
Micah: I mean...
Micah: Durmstrang obviously is very heavily involved in the Dark Arts, and they sit with a house that's associated with Tom Riddle and Voldemort. And Beauxbatons seems to find something about Ravenclaw that they like. You know, they're sort of the more intelligent, intellectual group, and that seems to be where they go to.
Eric: Yeah, I think if the - let's play the opposite here. I mean, if Durmstrang sat with Hufflepuff, you know, there might be a few Hufflepuffs...
Andrew: They wouldn't mix.
Eric: Yeah, there might be a few Hufflepuffs that wouldn't leave the table, or leave the Great Hall that night. You know, target practice. I don't know what the Durmstrang kids do. But yeah, I think the - considering that some of Beauxbatons, or at least Fleur Delacour, are actually Veela, as Micah just said, maybe it's just the Ravenclaws are more proper and can control themselves a little bit better. You know, Ravenclaws being intellectual, have more self control.
Andrew: It could also maybe be that the head of the house invites the students to sit at their table, but I agree - there's definitely some connection there.
Micah: Well, Ron was very strongly voicing his opinion for Viktor Krum to come sit over at the Gryffindor table. And you'd think, you know, Potter being over there, that that would be a lure for either of those two schools to want to sit there. But...
Andrew: Well, yeah, and we'll...
Micah: ...doesn't happen.
Andrew: ...talk about that more in a little bit. But the fame thing within the schools is kind of interesting because Viktor is sort of being treated by Ron as others do towards Harry - but Viktor has more of a celebrity to him, of course because of the World Cup, so...
Eric: You know what I...
Eric: ...just thought of?
Andrew: I don't know about that. What?
Eric: I just solved it. Viktor Krum - Durmstrang's associated with Slytherins, and Beauxbatons with the Ravenclaws, because together then the four champions also make up the four Hogwarts houses. Because Hufflepuff has their Cedric Diggory, so no one's, you know, the other two schools don't sit with them. And Gryffindor has Harry Potter, so...
Andrew: Hmm. That's interesting.
Eric: It's kind of foreshadowing where the champions, or the other schools are sitting with the houses that don't - and won't - have champions this year.
Andrew: Oh, that is interesting. I wonder if that was planned. But I still agree with Micah's point, the Beauxbaton/Ravenclaw and Slytherin/Durmstrang connections.
Andrew: Both valid points.
Micah: And also...
Andrew: Alright, so...
Micah: So Karkaroff and Snape are both former Death Eaters, I don't know if that has anything to do with it.
Eric: Karkaroff and Malfoy's father and all sorts of...
Andrew: Well, that's sort of my point, which is Snape knows Karkaroff so he could invite him, too...
Micah: Oh, okay.
Andrew: ...for his students to stay at the table.
Micah: So Dumbledore introduces Barty Crouch Sr., and Ludo Bagman - who joined the table up in the front of the hall - and he reveals the Goblet of Fire, he explains the guidelines and how you can go about entering. And, you know, I'm wondering why even have such strict guidelines for those that are entering. You know, isn't it dangerous regardless to expose 17 year olds to such binding magical contracts? I mean, Dumbledore explicitly says you know, when you put your name in the Goblet of Fire, it creates a binding magical contract. And, isn't this a little bit of a risk for somebody, no matter what age they are? I mean, we're talking about students here. Why put them in such harm?
Andrew: Well, that's the thrill of the Quidditch World Cup, but I think it's sort of mentioned a little later on that...
Eric: You mean the Triwizard Tournament?
Andrew: Sorry, yeah. [laughs] The Triwizard Tournament. That's the thrill of it is that there is danger to this and it tests the wizard or witch's true abilities...
Andrew: And their strengths so - I will say, though, I think there should have been more warning about, look, if you put your name in this, first of all - and they did warn you are committed to it - but second of all, this stuff really is dangerous. We're not kidding around here, this is not...
Andrew: ...some class lesson.
Eric: They really should have made it so other people couldn't put other people's name in the Goblet of Fire, too, but I guess then we wouldn't have a book.
Micah: Yeah, well, it's interesting, though - and we'll talk about this later on, I think, in the next chapter, or the one after that; I don't remember which one - but Ludo Bagman actually says that there wasn't an age restriction prior to this...
Micah: So, you know, we can talk about that a little bit once it comes up.
Eric: Well, it's interesting to compare because the magic of the Goblet of Fire has the ability to read a name that you put in and assess that person's criteria, as whether they're fit to be a school champion. So, based on their name on a slip of paper, it can judge their characteristics, their personality. That's the...
Eric: ...magic of the Goblet. So, Micah, what you just said, with the age restriction being a very new thing, it would be interesting to think that, a long time ago, someone who was younger, like a thirteen year old, could actually be chosen as a school champion along with a seventeen or an eighteen year old student.
Micah: Now, Fred and George jokingly ask Harry if he'll enter, and Harry wondered how angry Dumbledore would be if someone younger than seventeen did find a way to get over the age line, and my comment was, "Don't worry, Harry, you'll find out soon enough."
Andrew: [laughs] Mike Newell has solved this problem. Mike Newell along with Michael Gambon and the lovely folks at Warner Bros. Oh, man.
Micah: So, after the introduction of the Goblet of Fire they have their feast and as they are vacating the Great Hall, Karkaroff stops to stare at Harry. It takes him a couple seconds to realize who he is, but then Mad-Eye Moody comes along and there's this interesting interaction that takes place between the two. And we know Karkaroff is in a state of shock, because he's face to face with whom he believes to be Moody the Auror, but reading this for the first time, this should be a tip to Karkaroff's dark past.
Micah: Because, I mean, I understand Moody is not the best looking person in the world...
Micah: So, naturally people might have that kind of reaction upon seeing him, but the way that they say that Karkaroff goes white in the face, or he goes pale in the face, it's very clear that there's past history between these two.
Micah: And I know last show, Andrew, you mentioned, well, hopefully we see more of these types of moments, sort of these foreshadowing moments, throughout the course of the book. Now Moody, a.k.a. Barty Crouch Jr., has his magical eye fixed upon Karkaroff's back, a look of intense dislike upon his mutilated face, because he despises Karkaroff, who's a former Death Eater. And - so again it's sort of that split...
Eric: Meaning, Yeah.
Micah: ...perspective from Moody / Barty Crouch Jr. You could either read it that Moody has his eye fixed upon Karkaroff because he's a former Death Eater and they have a past history together, or because it's Barty Crouch Jr., who really hates this guy who has been a turncoat and tried to really make his past as a Death Eater invisible at this point.
Micah: You know what I'm saying?
Andrew: Yeah, I mean the real answer is that the latter - it's the latter.
Micah: It's Barty Crouch. Yeah.
Andrew: Right, but...
Micah: And he's pissed at Karkaroff for what he's done, leaving Voldemort and basically disowning the whole Death Eater thing and trying to start over by being this Head of or Headmaster at Durmstrang.
Andrew: Right. Of course the reader perspective is the first one - Moody. So - or why Moody's upset. So it's a cool double meaning.
Micah: Yeah, absolutely. And something you wouldn't catch unless - at least I didn't catch it.
Andrew: You'd have to read it the second time.
Micah: Yeah, exactly, exactly. Well, of course this is not the second time we're reading this book.
Eric: No, no! Come on. Please.
Micah: We've all read it hundreds of times. [laughs]
Andrew: Speak for yourselves.
Micah: It's only an eight hundred page novel. I mean...
Micah: So the next day the trio spend visiting Hagrid, and they get into a discussion about S.P.E.W. Andrew, there you go. I won't say the other word. And is it odd that Hagrid can really understand how house elves operate better than Hermione?
Eric: No. He...
Andrew: I don't think...
Andrew: Hermione - I think Hermione understands it. She just doesn't - she just won't accept it. It's not - it's more about personal opinion on slavery versus actual knowledge.
Eric: Hermione's got this...
Andrew: You know what I mean?
Eric: Yeah. Hermione has this inflated idea of what the house elves - not are capable of - but just of their perspective. Hagrid hangs around with loser magical beings all the time. And so it's not unusual that he can sympathize or at least put off this idea that he knows what they truly feel like. He hangs out with Aragog and all the creatures in the forest - Centaurs. Most people don't get along with. So the fact that he's lecturing Hermione on House Elves not wanting sick leaves and pension, that sort of thing as Nick had said earlier, I think it's fitting. And I think also that Hagrid cares about Hermione, and he doesn't want her getting too stressed out, involved in this cause that he feels is kind of a moot point or kind of not worth it, for good reasons.
Micah: Right, it's interesting to hear him say that they're happy with what they do and when he refers to Dobby as being, "an odd one in every lot."
Micah: He's sort of like - you get that weirdo in every group. For Hagrid to be saying that is a little bit comical and hypocritical but it just seems like - everybody in the wizarding world that is human seems to think that this is what House Elves are like and this is how their lives have always been and will continue to be.
Eric: Well, and unfortunately we do have the two case studies that have the worst masters. I mean, Dobby had the Malfoy's as his master and Winky has this troubled Crouch family as her master. So - and Barty Crouch Sr. is very near the end of his life, very manic, not quite stable as a master so when Jo is playing these race questions to us about what House Elves deserve and the kind of treatment that they get - it's very meant to resonate because we have these examples of House Elves being oppressed and the question she's trying to ask us is Hogwarts - and this is what Hermione is concerned with - is Hogwarts oppressing this race of House Elves?
Micah: Yeah, are they contributing to a larger problem. Yeah, absolutely. And so we finally get to Halloween evening and the Goblet of Fire selection and as we all know the Durmstrang champion is Viktor Krum, the Beauxbatons champion is Fleur Delacour and the Hogwarts champion is Cedric Diggory and then of course the fourth champion ends up being Harry Potter. So - that's really all I have for this chapter. There is - I don't really think there's much more to discuss. I mean, there's more fact in this chapter than topics to really go into.
Andrew: You don't need to make excuses.
Eric: Yeah, yeah.
Eric: That was a good - that was a weighty discussion.
Andrew: One thing we should talk about as we go in to this next chapter is why Cedric was chosen? Because during Micah's chapter we get the explanation that the Goblet will select based on skills and such, why was Cedric chosen? I mean Krum makes sense. Fleur for an all girl school...
Micah: Well, it's not all girls.
Eric: It's not all girls!
Eric: It is in the movie, that's the difference. The movie...
Micah: Yeah, it's not in the book.
Eric: ...portrays Beauxbatons as the all-girls school...
Eric: ...but in the book it is very much not.
Andrew: Well, putting them two aside, what is - why Cedric? I mean, then again to be fair who else really in the school stands out? I don't think any characters especially...
Eric: That's a good question.
Andrew: I don't think any characters at this point especially in the series would really...
Micah: It was to give Hufflepuff their one moment, really, in the series, aside probably from the final battle. I think if you look at it they're just irrelevant, and I don't mean that in a bad way. We'll get hundreds of frickin' e-mails now about how...
Eric: Are you kidding, I called House Elves a 'loser-race'.
[Eric and Micah laugh]
Eric: I don't think you'll get many more e-mails about that.
Micah: But I think that from a writing stand-point, the way that they're portrayed is just that they're not as relevant to the story, and they're not as relevant - really if you were attending Hogwarts they're sort of the overlooked house, and this was that one opportunity for them to be able to shine, and to have somebody represent them.
Eric: It's funny you should mention that because there is this whole paragraph devoted to Hufflepuffs in the next chapter. But I think Cedric Diggory represents - obviously he represents the qualities of his house, and because at this point - up to this point in the books it hadn't been clear what Hufflepuff was really about. I feel like Jo devoted a portion of this book, especially with the character of Cedric Diggory, to showing what kind of traits - like loyalty, I believe the Sorting Hat says regarding Hufflepuff - what exactly Hufflepuff had. So Cedric Diggory very much is the representation of Hufflepuff. But it shows as well - the fact that the Goblet of Fire chose him shows that there is some sort of quantifiable trait that goes into becoming a champion that Hufflepuff has. It doesn't rule them out of the coolest people on Earth list. It tries to give them a little boost-up.
Andrew: Yeah, and when you look at what Cedric has done, other than being a Quidditch player and also being a prefect there wasn't really anything stand-out. But then again, other than Harry Potter, I don't know if there are many stand-out superstar people in Hogwarts.
Micah: Right, I think...
Eric: You know what, Cedric is a good student! Let's not...
Andrew: Yeah. Yeah.
Eric: Let's not forget he's probably good at academics, and that counts for something. [laughs]
Micah: Yeah, I think the other side of it though too is he's popular. He's the one person that you could put Harry Potter against that is going to have the school turn on him, if that makes sense.
Micah: Here's somebody who's not just liked by Hufflepuff, he's really liked by all four houses. And if you take somebody like that and then have the counter be Harry people are going to be in favor of Cedric, because it seems like Harry gets all the glory, let's face it.
Andrew: Well, coming up next week we are going to have an exclusive interview with the Goblet of Fire...
[Eric and Micah laugh]
Andrew: ...whose going to tell us why he or she...
Eric: Are you kidding?
Eric: This is how it's going to go. It's going to be like a French man in a movie with a cigarette. He's like, "Yes. Well, I get their names. And I just - " No, wow! That derailed totally.
Eric: I feel like....
Andrew: Well, then...
Eric: I feel like - I'm just going to admit that was partially Mr. Burns, "Yes and not quite." But he's going to be like, "Yes, well, I get their names and I search them up on Facebook. Oh, that Cedric Diggory, he just has this incredible profile picture. These eyes, just like Matt Britton's eyes, they are just like beautiful and I just had to chose him because his Facebook - " It'd be something like that. So...
Chapter-by-Chapter: "The Four Champions"
Andrew: Well, all right. So, let's move on now to Chapter 17, "The Four Champions." Harry and everyone in the room are in shock that his name came out of the Goblet of Fire, of course, and the only person who seemed to be fascinated, really excited by it was Ludo Bagman. And Micah, you're wondering why was it that the age restriction was never in place before and why add it now?
Andrew: I mean...
Micah: Well, yeah. This kind of fits in here because this is where all the discussion starts between the Heads of the different schools, and Barty Crouch Sr., and Ludo Bagman. So Bagman does mention, as we talked about in the last chapter, that there wasn't an age restriction prior to this point. So the question is, why now? Why decide to implement an age restriction. One would think that it would be to prevent Harry from getting into the Triwizard Tournament. So it kind of backfires.
Andrew: But also it's...
Eric: But specifically Harry...
Andrew: But I also think it's just because it's dangerous. And they've realized we do need to put a restriction on it.
Andrew: Because when - when say a thirteen year old get's in there would probably be a lot of out lash in the wizarding world. Lot of people saying why would someone so young be able to fight even though the Goblet of Fire selects it based on...
Andrew: ...a good match for it. So theoretically the Goblet of Fire no matter what age would select someone based on if the Goblet thought it could...
Andrew: ...the person could compete successfully.
Eric: Let's not forget these people had the school Governors to answer to and if you want to say we're bringing back this ancient tournament that hasn't been held in hundreds of years you are going to have some new restrictions because there's a reason that the Triwizard Tournament hasn't been held in hundreds of years. It's dangerous, archaic even, like old barbaric torture chambers. That sort of thing.
Eric: And I feel the age restriction was just one of those things where if they ever had to take it to the Hogwarts school Governors, which realistically I'm sure they would, either that's the kind of thing that sugar coats it - that makes it seem less dangerous this time around.
Micah: What about - sorry I don't mean to cut you off but we talked a lot about this on the last Episode with the Unforgivable Curses but how would you be able to enter this tournament without parents' permission?
[Andrew and Eric laugh]
Andrew: Yeah, well now with the age limit I mean...
Eric: If you're seventeen...
Andrew: ...technically you're of age.
Eric: Yeah, you're of age.
Andrew: So, yeah.
Micah: Yeah, that's true.
Andrew: So moving along, Madame Maxime and Karkaroff express their disapproval that Harry was selected. But the way Jo describes Karkaroff's actions was interesting. I think it's sort of suggests that he was to blame here. She wrote,
"He was wearing a steely smile. His blue eyes were like chips of ice. He gave a short and nasty laugh."
Is this possibly a hint at that he was to blame? I mean it's not conclusive, but it was interesting. He seemed a little too pleased with it. I mean one could say he was pleased because this meant he could pick a fight with Dumbledore and possibly get his way and get another student selected to compete.
Andrew: But I think more likely he was pleased his plan worked and...
Micah: I think it's kind of a red herring. You're supposed to believe - because they do the same thing in the movie where they have Karkaroff go into the room with the Goblet of Fire and then he slowly closes the doors as he exits.
Micah: And I think you're supposed to believe that he's the one who put Harry's name in the Goblet of Fire because he's kind of one of those new characters that you don't know about and usually that's the one that ends up being the trouble maker. But I think it's just kind of a misleading description of - maybe he's just demented, I don't know.
Andrew: Well, it was - I think I agree it was a red herring. And definitely the first time you read that you probably could miss it unless you're looking for clues. So the group continues discussing with Maxime and Karkaroff reinforcing their disapproval when Moody comes in. And Moody begins suggesting it was a powerful wizard who is to blame for this, of course hinting that it was Karkaroff, but Karkaroff of course has none of it. Bagman on the other hand is very excited by the new twist. He was very excited that there was going to be this fun new element to the game with four people. So why was he so excited? I mean it's kind of cruel. He should - was he excited because it would make headlines...
Andrew: ...there was a fourth player and the person was underage and was Harry Potter. I mean I guess from a press standpoint it was gold.
Micah: Oh, yeah, this is great. And it's a money maker for him. You know he's going to go out and bet on the tournament.
Eric: That's true.
Micah: I'd bet on Harry Potter.
Eric: Wait, would you though?
Micah: Wouldn't you?
Eric: Would you? I mean...
Micah: Probably, I mean, he's got a good enough track record, you look at the past three books. I mean, I'd bet on him winning.
Eric: I feel like, if you just compare him to Krum, you've got this international Quidditch star, and some kid who plays Quidditch on the weekends for his school - for his high school.
Eric: It's kind of a big difference.
Micah: Yeah, no, I mean, I agree, but this also sets up the plot point that Ludo Bagman is possibly hoping to win back enough money to pay off Fred and George, whom he owes a large sum of money to.
Micah: So I think that's part of the reason why he might be happy as well, and I don't know though, as far as betting goes you bring up a good point. I mean, there's probably a number of different reasons to bet money on any of them.
Andrew: Eric, I think you added this next point. You're wondering why Dumbledore did not comment when Mr. Crouch gave a different interpretation of the rules than Dumbledore had the previous evening.
Eric: That's not my comment.
Micah: Yeah, I added that, I'm sorry.
Andrew: Oh, Micah - he says that:
"If someone's name is ejected from the Goblet, he is required to compete in the tournament."
The rulebook wording almost certainly states that any person entering his name into the Goblet must compete. So Micah, you're saying, the fact that Harry didn't enter his name means that he shouldn't have to compete. However, everyone's pretty skeptical of Harry, everyone, as we're going to discuss in a little bit, everyone thinks that it was Harry that put his name in. So...
Micah: Well, the reason why I put this point in here is that Dumbledore specifically states that any person entering his name creates this magical binding contract, but Barty Crouch Sr. says, only when the name is ejected it creates this magical binding contract.
Eric: Oh, I get it.
Micah: And the point being that this should have been a tip-off that something's wrong with Barty Crouch Sr. He acts really odd during this whole process and this is the starting point of seeing him deteriorate throughout the course of the next few chapters. And I just thought this was a early shot - an early look into the fact that he wasn't in the right state, because think about what's just happened. They've just added a fourth champion to an event that's only had three champions for how many hundreds of years. And he's complicit in all of this. He's not willing to stand up and say something about it. So it's clear that the Imperius Curse is working its toll on him.
Eric: Yeah, I like that discrepancy, too, where it is a binding magical contract, but like all contracts you need to sign somewhere, and I feel like you sign when you put your name in not when the Goblet chooses your name - it should be that by entering, by putting your hand in, maybe you have to...
Eric: ...dip your hand in whatever's in the Goblet - [clears throat] excuse me - whatever's in the Goblet, and you know, that creates the contract.
Micah: But the point is he should know this. This is his tournament, and for him to be, you know, so off on the rules...
Eric: Yeah, but doesn't it suck...
Micah: Even on a small point like this.
Eric: Doesn't it suck that they got to him?
[Eric and Micah laugh]
Micah: Yeah, but - I mean, this is sort of the groundwork being laid, and you know, he should be really opposed to this whole thing that's happening. He should be launching an investigation into it. You know, we hear Percy talk about him so much as being this stickler for detail earlier on in the book...
Micah: And this is clearly not the same person.
Eric: Yeah, I blame Dumbledore more because Dumbledore is a character we know more than we know this Barty Crouch Sr. stranger, and I blame Dumbledore for letting all of this go on. You know, Dumbledore likes to pretend that his hands are tied, but I feel like maybe he just has his nails painted and he doesn't want anybody seeing his hands right now, because...
Micah: Yeah, and...
Eric: You know...
Andrew: Yeah, he lets it off a little too easily.
Micah: Yeah, I agree. And I think the fact that Barty Crouch Sr. refused to stay for a drink - and you know, if you noticed, there is that one scene where Moody kind of stepped in - it's all about Barty Crouch Jr. exerting this control over his father and making sure that nothing happens to compromise. You know, the plan...
Andrew: So Crouch introduces the first task, and says "We are not going to be telling you what the first task is. Courage in the face of the unknown is an important quality in the wizard... very important..."
Andrew: Which I thought sort of relates to Book 7 when Harry's facing Voldemort, with the whole courage thing. I thought that was kind of, you know, kind of related. The meeting wraps up, and as Harry and Cedric walk back to their respective common rooms, Cedric asks Harry how he did put his name in the Goblet. Harry says "No, I didn't. I insist," but Cedric doesn't believe him, which disappoints Harry. So Harry gets back into his common room and Harry is met with a lot of support from fellow Gryffindors. He doesn't like it though, because he still is really confused about all this, and he's too preoccupied wondering how the hell his name did get in there. And to make matters worse, once he's in bed, Ron also questions whether he put his name in the cup. Harry denies it but Ron still doesn't believe him, even though, as Harry says, it should be Ron who - Ron of all people who trusts him.
Micah: And here's why I don't like this whole thing. It's that Ron's pretty much with him 24/7...
Micah: So one would think he would know if he put his name in, and that's what bothers me about this more than anything else. But it's just Ron being an immature prick.
Eric: Well, it's just that. Due to the duration of time that Ron spends with Harry, that was why he was so upset. It's because he internalized it and said "Well, despite all the time I'm spending with Harry, he still snuck off and did this. Why wouldn't he have shared that with me? We're together like almost all the time."
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