MuggleCast | The #1 Most-Listened to Harry Potter Podcast 3

MuggleCast 236 Transcript (continued)

Deathly Hallows - Part 2 Discussion: Overall Thoughts

Andrew: Okay. Anyway, let's move on to a discussion on Deathly Hallows - Part 2. We talked about it on Episode 234 which was live at LeakyCon. We had Evanna Lynch on, we had listeners coming up throwing in their opinions. Richard, let's start with you because you're the only one on this panel right now who wasn't at that live show. What did you think of Deathly Hallows - Part 2?

Richard: I thought - oh, I just hated it, hated it, hated it.

[Andrew laughs]

Richard: It just sucked so much. No, I'm kidding, really. I loved it. I really liked it. This is the first movie that I've actually really enjoyed. I've never particularly liked any of the previous ones enough to want to watch them more than once or twice. But no, I came out - I saw this one twice and I came out of the cinema both times thinking, "Wow, I really liked that." There was just - there's various reasons for it. My biggest complaint with Part 1 was that I thought the acting - particularly from Dan Radcliffe - I thought it was really, really bad. In so many scenes, it was kind of cringeworthy. And what's more is the trio were kind of by themselves in it for most of the film because a lot of the older cast like Alan Rickman and Maggie Smith and Julie Walters, they didn't really appear in it so much since it was just Harry, Ron, and Hermione camping.

Andrew: Yeah.

Richard: So they had to hold the film by themselves and I didn't really think they managed it very well, whereas in this film, a) the experienced cast came back, and b) it wasn't really a dialogue-y film. It was very much an action film, so it didn't need to rely on great acting. They just needed to rely on great action, and they did. They pulled that off really well. I thought, in particular, Dan was actually really convincing, really good at that type of stuff, and much better than the serious stuff. So I couldn't really fault the film in that way whatsoever. And the more experienced cast - well, they were - they really stepped up their game, particularly Alan Rickman who was just fantastic.

Andrew: And...

Eric: Well, don't forget Ralph Fiennes.

Andrew: Yeah, and Maggie Smith. I mean, all three of them were really standouts for me.

Richard: Yeah, exactly! I mean, there was bits that I didn't like. I still think the Harry and Ginny thing is just - doesn't portray well in the films whatsoever.

Andrew: No.

Richard: They've never got that right at all, and they didn't get it right this time either.

Andrew: You know who I blame for that? I blame Bonnie Wright. I really...

Eric: Wow.

Andrew: I've never liked her.

Richard: You know something? I met her at the premiere and I asked her a couple of questions, and the way you interact with her there is a lot different to how she appears in the film, so I actually - until that, I did as well, but since I met her I don't blame her. I blame the writers and I blame the director for it.

Andrew: Mmm.

Deathly Hallows - Part 2 Discussion: 3D

Richard: The 3D - 3D, ask my arse. I did not get...

[Andrew and Micah laugh]

Richard: ...what was so big of her whatsoever. I wish 3D...

Andrew: What was that phrase?

Richard: Ask my arse.

Andrew: Ask my arse.

Eric: Ask my - like...

Richard: I guess it's a local phrase. But the point is...

[Andrew and Eric laugh]

Andrew: Local.

[Richard laughs]

Andrew: Go ahead.

Richard: The point is that I just wish 3D would die already, really. But in this film - it just added nothing to it at all! I didn't - I forgot that I was watching 3D for the most part of it. The only time I remembered it was when my glasses slid down my nose and I had to push them back up again. I went, "Oh yeah! I'm watching..."

Ben: Those glasses are so uncomfortable!

Richard: [laughs] Yeah.

Ben: And I sweat a lot, naturally...

[Andrew and Richard laugh]

Ben: ...and I was just like wiping my eyes, drying them off on my shirt. And honestly, for parts of the film, I sat there with my glasses off...

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: ...and stared at the blurry-as screen...

[Richard laughs]

Ben: ...because I couldn't be bothered to have the glasses on that were giving me a headache. So, I agree fully. Do away with 3D.

Andrew: There's been reports that it's not healthy. 3D is not good for your eyes!

Richard: Good!

Andrew: It's a fad, it's going to go away.

Richard: Let it die.

Eric: There will always be those reports. But - no, I will agree, with the 3D in this film. So we saw it - when I saw it the first time, I saw it in 3D, and then just today I saw it before recording this show, and I saw it in 2D. And I have to agree. Not only was the 3D not very noticeable in the film - it added some depth here, foreground, background, that sort of thing. But all in all, there were not scenes that really, really stood out. Also, just having the glasses on, like Ben said, was a distraction. There was - towards the end of the film, second half, I thought of crying, but every time I would start to cry, my glasses would fog up and I couldn't see the screen!

[Andrew and Richard laugh]

Eric: So, it's a little restrictive there. I couldn't really be myself when I was wearing the 3D...

Andrew: You created a climate within your eye sockets.

Eric: It was a small ecosystem.

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: So I wasn't able to really enjoy the film as much in 3D, but when I saw it in 2D I just thought it was a lot better. I could focus a lot more on the acting.

Andrew: See, David Yates had said - and I agree with him completely - it's not supposed to really stand out in this film. It's supposed to be out of the way. It's not supposed to be distracting, that's the phrase he used a lot.

Eric: Yeah, but if you're going to do that...

Richard: So why do you have to pay more for it then? So...

Eric: Exactly. If you're going to do that with a film, then don't do it at all because theaters - the studios are going to charge so much more for 3D. You have to almost make it this blatant - you have to pander to 3D in order to make it worth...

Andrew: Well...

Eric: ...people's money. But yeah.

Andrew: But it does get good during the action scenes. He was saying it shouldn't be distracting during dialogue and informational scenes like at the beginning of the film, really, when Harry is talking to Griphook and Ollivander. You really don't see it there. You do see it - the Gringotts escape, the final battle at the end. But it's not obnoxious and I appreciated that. I don't know, I don't know.

Ben: Well, when the - the only time the 3D really worked for me was when the Voldy-fetti came out at the end.

[Micah laughs]

Ben: I felt like it was coming down on me like I was in Times Square...

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: ...New Year's Eve.

[Richard laughs]

Ben: Not really though.

Eric: The Voldy-fetti?

Ben: Yeah.

Andrew: I saw you throw your hands in the air and you were like twirling around.

Ben: Well, the thing is, if you see 3D - like actual, legit IMAX where you're laying back in your seat a little bit looking up at the big dome screen, that would be legitimate. But sitting in these...

Eric: Well, that's OMNIMAX.

Ben: That's OMNIMAX?

Eric: I think so.

Ben: Oh okay, I've always thought that was IMAX because that was what I grew up with knowing, is IMAX.

Andrew: Well, the screens are a lot bigger in a normal - in a real IMAX theater.

Eric: That's true.

Andrew: I think that's what you're talking about.

Eric: But then there's also the difference between being shot in 3D and being converted to 3D, where...

Richard: Yeah, this was converted.

Eric: ...Avatar - yeah, where Avatar was shot, and Avatar is the biggest, best example because that was the pioneer. It was shot in 3D, it was meant to - scenes are shot from a certain angle so as to be in 3D. You're supposed to think about it. That film almost shouldn't exist in 2D, I would argue. But then there's Harry Potter and other films like it that are converted to 3D where it does add some depth in terms of - if Harry is in the foreground, and you see Hogwarts burning in the background. There's more depth there, it's a little bit out of - unusual, but they're not able to really - even with the snake, when Nagini strikes and Neville comes and cuts his head off. In 3D, it really didn't jump out all that much, and I guess the difference is the Voldy-fetti, like Ben said. That was really a moment where I said, "Wow, the confetti is coming out into the audience, and Voldemort is kind of disgusting right now but we're all going to be wearing him in a moment." So, that shocked me, but the majority of the film it just went unused or not obtrusive.

Andrew: So, let's - Micah?

Micah: Yeah, I'm here.

Andrew: Oh. It sounded like you wanted to add some wisdom.

Micah: Oh.

Andrew: No?

Micah: About 3D?

Andrew: Yeah.

Micah: No, I agree with a lot of what you guys were saying. I saw it yesterday for the first time in 2D and - the 3D just didn't do a whole lot for me when I saw it the first two times. It just - it didn't add anything. I think the only other scene I can remember that hasn't been talked about yet was just with the Dementors, where they seem to pop out when they show that scene of Hogwarts, and they're kind of just floating above it. But I mean, I don't understand the point of why they went ahead and did the film in 3D, if they weren't going to make it sort of this full experience. And to whoever's point where he said when you go the theater and you pay for 3D, you are paying more so you expect to get more out of it, so I don't it's fair to just say that - Andrew, you said you appreciated the fact that it didn't jump out at you, but that's why people are spending extra money because they're expecting more of an experience when they go to see the film.

Andrew: Mmm. Well, look - I mean, the reason that they did do 3D was because of the [pauses] money! So it wouldn't have hit one billion by now if they didn't have 3D, so that's the reason why, at the end of the day.

Ben: Joe Warner!

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: We're all here talking to line Joe Warner's pockets at the end of the day.

Deathly Hallows - Part 2 Discussion: Shell Cottage

Andrew: [laughs] Let's go through some major scenes in the film. We'll start with one of the ones that I just mentioned with the subtle 3D. It was Harry and Griphook, and Harry and Ollivander when he's talking to both of them.

Richard: That was another thing that kind of niggled me with it, with the film, was that...

Eric: Niggled you?

Richard: Niggled, yeah. Annoyed.

Andrew: All these new phrases.

[Richard laughs]

Andrew: Keep it up!

Ben: We're cultured here on MuggleCast.

Richard: Yeah, I kind of thought that the whole storyline of the Hallows by itself seemed to be cut from the film. I don't know - because they're hardly featured in it. And I remember Ollivander talking about the Hallows, and I remember thinking, "Why does Ollivander know about them in the first place and no one else did other than Dumbledore and Luna's dad? Even Voldemort didn't know about them in the books, he just knew about the legend of the wand." So that kind of annoyed me for some reason, and I can see why they did it because other than that little speech there, the Deathly Hallows basically don't make any other [laughs] appearance in the film. The Invisibility Cloak is seen very, very briefly. The Resurrection Stone again is just shown up at the very end.

Andrew: Yeah.

Richard: Other than that, they basically are irrelevant to the plot in the movie.

Micah: The big thing - yeah. I mean, the big thing that was cut out from that scene I think is that Harry is supposed to have a choice. I mean, it's supposed to be Horcruxes or Hallows.

Richard: Yeah, and he chooses to go after the Hallows - after the Horcruxes, like Dumbledore asked him to. But again, that didn't really make it into it, so that scene kind of ñ that was one of the few scenes in the film that bugged me. I mean, I still loved the film overall but there were just a few little things that kind of put me off it.

Andrew: Yeah. Yeah, and look, they're wrapping up all these little points and I think they did do a good job wrapping up most of the big things. But yeah, I agree that was one of those things. And honestly, sort of like at the beginning of the film, I had a hard time concentrating because I'm sort of like still so excited about - oh my God, I'm watching Part 2.

Eric: [laughs] Well...

Andrew: And I can't even focus on what they're saying.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: Plus my ears have to adjust to the British - English accent.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: I don't know if anyone else has this problem, but...

[Richard laughs]

Andrew: ...for the first ten minutes of every Potter film, I'm always trying to figure out what they're saying.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: Honest to God.

Richard: Funnily enough, I don't have this problem.

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: Yeah, with Part 1 it was like that because they're all - at the "Seven Potters" scene, right? And it's all very quick dialogue.

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: So you almost can't - you really can't understand what they're saying. I still don't know the one line that Fred says that ends with "scrawny, sucky git forever." I don't know how that sentence begins.

Andrew: Mmm.

Eric: Or "specky git." I don't understand it. But however, today when I saw the film I was paying attention to the beginning, Shell Cottage, and I was getting in the mood because it's very mood-setting. But also I really noticed Dan Radcliffe and his acting, and how he basically goes into a bedroom where there is a complete stranger and gets what he wants from them. But the gravity of the situation is very clear and I thought that the acting of Dan did a really good job to convey that, where he pushes people and really just - he's Harry, he's going into the final battle.

Andrew: Okay, so back to the beginning of the movie... [laughs]

Micah: Well, I was just going to say, how creepy was Warwick Davis...

Andrew: As Griphook?

Micah: Griphook? [laughs]

Ben: [imitates Hagrid's voice] Warwick Davis!

[Andrew and Micah laugh]

Ben: He was - he hasn't been creepier since...

Micah: The Leprechaun.

Ben: ...since he was Leprechaun, yeah.

Micah: Yeah.

Ben: I saw Leprechaun: In the Hood the other day and I was like, "Wow!"

Micah: [laughs] Leprechaun: In the Hood.

Ben: Yeah.

Andrew: You went to the hood for a Leprechaun screening?

Micah: No, no, it's a movie.

Ben: No, it's a movie.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: Oh.

Ben: It's like a spin-off...

Andrew: [laughs] Oh! I see.

Ben: ...of the original.

Andrew: Yeah, I mean...

Eric: Is that Warwick Davis though?

Ben: Yeah, I think so, I'm pretty sure.

Deathly Hallows - Part 2 Discussion: Gringotts

Andrew: Okay, so, Gringotts! They go down in - I talked about this, I think at the Leaky - the live - the show at LeakyCon. [laughs] They're going to turn this into a theme park ride. It's when the trio descend deep into the bowels of Gringotts to get to the Lestrange vault.

Eric: You know what I thought about that? When I was watching it - and those train cars, though, in the movie are really cool. They're very bare bones. I don't know, it would be kind of dangerous to do that, but they should make the cars. If they do this ride, they need to make the cars just like that.

Richard: Were they the same type of carts that were in the very first movie?

Andrew: No, no way. You know how they always change these things? I think...

Eric: Well, even the foyer of Gringotts was different, at least I thought.

Richard: Yeah, I thought it was as well.

Andrew: Well, it's just like the castle...

Eric: Well, yeah.

Andrew: ...and the layout of the Hogwarts grounds. They change it almost every film, based on their needs really.

Eric: Mhm. Well, it helps that they have a castle like Hogwarts which changes - in the books it just changes.

Andrew: Well, it doesn't add and remove towers, but... [laughs]

Eric: Well, it does though. The stairs...

Andrew: Oh yeah, the stairs move.

Eric: The stairs leave - yeah.

Andrew: [laughs] Right. And actually, this is where one of the 3D scenes really stood out. It's when the gold multiplies when it's touched in the Lestrange vault.

Eric: Oh yeah.

Andrew: And you really do see the 3D here, and it was good, I thought, but that scene for some reason - I don't know. When Griphook yells, "The sword for the cup!" and it just...

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: It felt - it didn't look like how it did on the UK cover, [laughs] I'll put it that way. Not that it's supposed to be, but...

Eric: Well, in the book, doesn't it start melting? Everything turns really hot? There's like this claustrophobic...

Richard: Well - yeah, they become very, very hot when the new jewels or bits of metal are created, then they're all burning as they appear.

Eric: So that element was removed from the escape scene, but obviously, they still have a lot to deal with in this scene.

Andrew: Jumping along quite a bit, Aberforth. He...

Eric: Whoa! Hang on.

Andrew: What? What?

Eric: Well, what about the escape scene? How did that look to you guys?

Andrew: Oh.

Eric: What did you think?

Ben: Oh, I thought the escape scene was good. You're talking about the dragon, riding the dragon out of there?

Eric: Yeah.

Ben: I thought that was awesome! That was really cool. And then they kind of let go of the dragon and fall into the water. Isn't that what they did?

Eric and Richard: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah, that was cool.

Eric: My favorite part of that scene is when the dragon has just left the lobby, and he actually - he stops to take a break. He breathes in and out before...

Andrew: Yeah, that was my...

Eric: ...flying.

Andrew: I really appreciated that, too.

Eric: It was...

Andrew: Because he's breathing fresh air for the first time in probably forever.

Eric: Yeah, and he's just exhausted. He's been kept up, and all that, so I thought that was very, very realistic, and I really appreciated that.

Micah: Now, one of the things that came up that people were asking about on the show that we did in Orlando was: how did everybody from the bank end up in Malfoy Manor? And I watched the movie again yesterday, and it is Malfoy Manor, it's not Gringotts, so I don't...

Eric: Yeah, yeah. They've just totally turned the Malfoy Manor into a bloodbath. I'm pretty sure Lucius and Narcissa don't appreciate...

[Andrew laughs]

Micah: So what - in the book - I can't remember, does Voldemort summon all of them? Is that what he does, or does he...

Eric: Well, it's policy to notify of a break-in, and when - so I think they're dispatched to the Malfoy Manor to notify Bellatrix that her vault has been broken into, if I'm remembering correctly, and that's when Voldemort goes insane.

Andrew: And that's a really cool little moment, by the way, when Voldemort does have that realization of what happened. It happens when Harry - the trio jump into the water, and Harry kind of comes up for air, after being submerged in the water, and that's when the flashes start to happen, where Voldemort knows what happens and he goes on this killing spree within Malfoy Manor. Very cool, and I loved all those little moments when Voldemort has - recognizes what's going on, what Harry is doing.

Ben: Now, do you think - if we tried to step outside of our - we're all, obviously, big fans. If we try to step outside our perspective of these films, as insiders, and try to look at it as somebody who's just seen these movies and they're witnessing those scenes going on, do you think that Warner Bros. counts on the popularity of the series? That somebody - the average moviegoer who may not understand those things, is going to have somebody within a few feet of them who can explain to them what exactly is going on? Or do you think that through the films they have accurately conveyed those story lines to the point to where the average Joe can understand precisely what is happening in those moments without the help of somebody else?

Eric: Well...

Andrew: I don't think they can understand.

Eric: Well, if you - I can't speak for the other movies, but this film in particular had the dialogue there to support it. Not only was there that ringing noise when Harry - how Harry finds a Horcrux.

Andrew: Yeah, that was very helpful.

Eric: Which is very helpful, but also, that scene when he first comes up from jumping off the dragon and they're changing their clothes, it really is like three minutes of straight dialogue about how Voldemort knows that they're destroying the Horcruxes, that there's one left, that it's this, that, the other thing. So that's all they're talking about, but it's kind of - it's weird because they've snuck that dialogue in. It's in there, but casual fans...

Andrew: See, that wasn't fair though.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: I didn't think that was fair because Harry and Ron were taking off their shirts and I was too distracted.

Eric: Oh. See...

Andrew: I couldn't follow the dialogue at the same time.

Eric: Well, you missed it, exactly. So it's...

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: I guess the people who wouldn't normally watch the Harry Potter films wouldn't normally be attracted to Harry and Ron, they'll hear the dialogue. Meanwhile, everybody else is paying attention to the characters and not listening to the dialogue, which is a very clever way to do it.

Richard: Why did Harry and Ron take their wet clothes off, but Hermione didn't?

Andrew: Well, duh! Because we can't see a topless girl.

Ben: Oh, speaking of which, remember...

Micah: She didn't have to take everything off.

[Richard laughs]

Ben: Everybody remembers back when Prisoner of Azkaban happened?

Andrew: Yeah?

Eric: That's a good word for it.

Ben: There was that one movie poster where Emma's breasts...

Eric: You're thinking of Order of the Phoenix. You're thinking of Order of the Phoenix.

Ben: Was that Order of the Phoenix?

Andrew: Yeah, it was Order of the Phoenix.

Ben: I thought there was - I thought there were - I thought it happened every book. But anyways, the - yeah, I guess - was she underage at that time? Was she eighteen or was she nineteen?

Andrew: I don't know.

Eric: So what's the point?

Ben: Regardless, the point I'm trying to make is that at the beginning of this film they're making no bones about it. They're kind of putting Emma's whosa-whatsies out there.

[Richard laughs]

Micah: Yeah. Well, when she...

Andrew: I disagree.

Micah: No, no, when she fell in the - in the bank?

Andrew: Oh yes.

Eric: In the bank? I noticed that.

Micah: You got a clear shot of...

Andrew: See, this is where we get...

[Micah laughs]

Andrew: ...a hundred e-mails from women, saying, "This is why there needs to be a girl on the show."

[Andrew and Richard laugh]

Eric: On the show, yeah. No - although, I will say, it was very intimate - that Horcrux destruction scene from Part 1 was very intimate, where she's topless, Harry's topless, and they're embracing. There's a lot of...

Richard: They was CGI.

Eric: Yeah, it was CGI, but I'm saying...

Richard: And it was very obvious CGI.

Eric: Just in general, the films are very - I don't know how obvious it was to you, Richard, but not very much to me. But I think that, in general, these are more mature films.

Deathly Hallows - Part 2 Discussion: Aberforth

Andrew: So let's get into Aberforth now. We see him having a good discussion with Harry, and Ron and Hermione, when they Apparate into Hogsmeade and knick of time, Aberforth runs to the door and is like, "Get in here!" And what didn't sit right with me about this scene is that why would they trust Harry - why would Harry, Ron, and Hermione trust this random guy - they can't see who it is - saying "Come in here"? I mean, that was very risky.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: They should have had this moment where they at least saw who it was, but then that wouldn't have made sense because they don't know who it is.

Eric: So they're running through Hogsmeade and the guards are there. But they come to a gate, actually, and the gate is locked and they don't seem to remember Alohomora. [laughs] So they're kind of stuck, and somebody says, "Come here, Potter!" It just doesn't seem to be - it's not like an imminent threat, so I think he just goes because somebody recognizes him obviously. But it's - very obviously somebody who wants to help them. There's no...

Andrew: And they have no other choice, too.

Eric: Yeah, because they've forgotten Alohomora. Yeah.

Andrew: Yeah. [laughs] Forgotten Alohomora.

Ben: Well, what did you think about the interaction between Harry and Aberdore?

Andrew and Eric: Aberforth?

Andrew: It was good, but apparently they shot - as Richard, when he interviewed Ciar·n Hinds on the red carpet at the London premiere - he said that they shot a lot more, right, Richard?

Richard: Yeah. [laughs] I was just about to bring this up, I think I inadvertently revealed to him how much of his character was actually cut from this film. [laughs] He didn't really know.

Andrew: Yeah, but you made it sound bad though.

[Richard laughs]

Andrew: I mean, there was still plenty of stuff in it.

Richard: Oh no, yeah.

Eric: I thought there was.

Andrew: He was about to cry.

Richard: What I was getting at was that I was disappointed that the whole backstory with Dumbledore and his family was cut.

Andrew: He probably doesn't even know the book, does he?

Richard: No, he did say he had read the books, and he knew about the character. But I think he [laughs] assumed that his entire character was cut as a result and sort of panicked a little bit.

Andrew: Right. Yeah, you almost made him cry.

Richard: [laughs] I felt really guilty.

Andrew: We have HD video. I could see his eyes watering up.

Richard: [laughs] Yeah. But no, he was a really great guy as well.

Andrew: Mhm.

Ben: I thought that the - just the way there was kind of that tension between Aberforth and Harry, where Harry was kind of like, "You suck, you don't really - you're not out there..."

Eric: "You've given up."

Ben: "...on the front lines." Yeah, that's what he says.

Eric: He says, "You've given up."

Andrew: Yeah.

Ben: And then he says, "Had I -" Hermione says, "Had he given up, would he be here now?" or something like that.

Eric: Yeah, she has that extra line, which was very in-character, but I was shocked because it was such an in-character line...

Micah: Yeah, the...

Eric: ...where she is disagreeing with Harry.

Micah: The interesting thing about that scene was that - the interview we had with David Yates, he said that JK Rowling helped to write the whole Aberforth scene.

Andrew: Oh interesting.

Eric: He said she had input. He said she was very...

Micah: Helpful.

Eric: ...helpful.

Micah: Yeah.

Eric: Yeah.

Micah: But I...

Andrew: Oh.

Eric: In terms of how to do that.

Micah: It was weird dialogue because I don't think he was - he was never really introduced prior to this film, except for a brief cameo in Order of the Phoenix, right? And it wasn't even Ciar·n Hinds at the time, who played him, so...

Andrew: [laughs] Right.

Eric: No, I actually felt that that was one of this film's strengths, was having actors like Ciar·n Hinds, and the Grey Lady, for instance. Characters we had never met before, but they have such screen presence and they really have a character that you appreciate. And you cheer for Ciar·n Hinds when he shows up in battle and shoots the Patronus against all the Dementors.

Micah: Yeah, I mean, one of the complaints that I have about this film - and I like the film overall, I think it's probably the best in the series - is just the whole - they cut Dumbledore's backstory from this a lot. I mean, they didn't learn a whole lot about him, and Aberforth talks about Dumbledore's - what? I was...

Richard: They cut it because they cut the Hallows. The backstory was only relevant to the Hallows, for his quest to find them in the first place with Grindelwald. So since they cut all the Hallows out, what was the point of having Dumbledore's backstory as well?

Micah: Well, it's just there was a couple of things that were mentioned, like when Aberforth talks about Dumbledore's quest for power. It's like, well, what quest for power? We don't - as a moviegoer, we don't know anything about that. And then when Hermione says, "That's your sister Ariana." Well, how would Hermione know that? There's no explanation.

Richard: [laughs] Yeah.

Eric: She read that book!

Micah: Well, yeah, we know that, but...

Eric: She's seen reading that book in Part 1, though. I mean, it's not like we need to be spoon-fed everything, right?

Andrew: Yes, we do, because - I mean, this is what Ben was kind of mentioning earlier, that there does need to be somebody - say my mom. She needs guidance through these films because - she's read the books, or she's read a few of them, but there's a lot here. This is a very intricate plot and they don't really explain everything sometimes, as evidenced by this little conversation right now. So...

Richard: I just want to say for the record that you're all being more negative of the film than I am.

[Everyone laughs]

Andrew: Well, we're still not to the end where we're like, "Overall it was fantastic."

[Eric laughs]

Deathly Hallows - Part 2 Discussion: The Trio's Performances

Ben: Well, the other thing that I wanted to comment on is the performances of Dan, Rupert, and Emma. I think that overall - I think we've just gotten used to their particular interpretations of these characters and so it's like - when we say, "Oh, was that - was Dan's performance of Harry good?" I mean, I think we've just known him as Harry for so long that - Dan does a good "Dan being Harry." I don't think...

Eric: Oh, I disagree with that. I mean, I don't think he does a bad "Dan being Harry," but...

Ben: Huh?

Eric: I think there were some moments where Dan exceptionally shined through as Harry, or that he brought something to the role of Harry that I'd always wanted to be there in the books.

Ben: I don't know. I just - the older I've gotten, the harder time I've had buying these characters, buying these people as the characters. I mean, it's been so ingrained in our minds that it's hard to kind of detach from that, but I think that hands down the adult actors - the Alan Rickman's, the Maggie Smith's, the Richard Harris's - I mean Michael Gambon's - they save the films, I think.

Eric: That's almost what Richard said, is that the adults saved the film from the kids, which...

Andrew: I find that fascinating.

Richard: Originally...

Ben: Oh, did you say that, Richard?

Richard: I would've said that originally but in this film I don't think - I think that the adults did a very good performance, but I don't think the kids put in a bad performance, because it was an action-packed film. It wasn't reliant on the dialogue.

Andrew: It...

Richard: And the kids generally can do action well, they were younger. In previous films I would have agreed with you, I would have said that the adult cast bring a level of credibility to it and authenticity that the child actors just - they don't have the pedigree to do, they don't have the experience to do, and you can't expect them to either.

Ben: Yeah.

Richard: But in this film I thought because of the type of film it was, because it was an action film, I thought the gap in between the experienced cast and inexperienced cast - the divide was reduced a lot because it wasn't as important.

Ben: Yeah.

Richard: So I was able to enjoy the film a lot more as a result of that. I wasn't thinking, "Oh, this isn't believable," or "Oh, this isn't - this is a sucky acting performance." I was thinking, "Wow! This is just some awesome action scenes."

Ben: Yeah, I'll give you that. I agree with that as well. I think that that being said with all the other films, there have been a few lines or some lame scene or something that just didn't work that stood out to me in the initial viewings of it. And I've seen this one twice and I haven't really - I can't pinpoint a line right now offhand that Hermione or Ron or Harry said that was just so beyond lame or just didn't work, so...

Richard: There was no cringy dancing in this, at least.

[Eric laughs]

Ben: Yeah.

Andrew: Oh, that was nice.

Richard: Awww, that was awful.

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October 8, 2014

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#244 (November 20th, 2011): For the first time ever, MuggleCast has a DVD commentary! Watch Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows - Part 2 on DVD with us. We'll comment on each and every scene - it's as if we're in your living room watching alongside you!

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