Andrew [Show Intro with music in background]: Because it was just a year ago today that Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince was released - oh, it's bringing back memories - this is MuggleCast Episode 48 for July 16th, 2006.
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Hello everyone and welcome back to the show. I'm Andrew Sims.
Ben: I'm Ben Schoen.
Kevin: I'm Kevin Steck.
Jamie: I'm Jamie Lawrence.
Eric: And I'm Eric Scull.
Andrew: And this is the show where we bring you the latest in Harry Potter news, theories, discussions, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And now, we've learned that we total cars.
[Someone makes car noise]
Andrew: Any reaction?
[Someone makes car noise again]
Andrew: Before we go anywhere else, Micah Tannenbaum's standing by in the MuggleCast News Center with the past week's top Harry Potter news stories.
Micah: In a list of the 100 greatest family films compiled by Channel 4, Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone came in at Number 15. ET, Shrek, and Mary Poppins took the top three spots.
At the 2006 Home Entertainment Awards, Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire picked up prizes in the categories of "DVD Extras of the Year" and "Sell-Through Title of the Year." The Awards recognise outstanding achievement in home video.
A new article published by Entertainment Weekly gives their take on the top sidekicks ever to be together, from real life to fantasy. Ron Weasley and Hermione Granger come in together at Number 11 behind the likes of Ed McMahon, Robin, and George Costanza.
Electronic Arts, the worldwide video game developer known to us for their work on the Harry Potter video game franchise, announced yesterday that they are actively developing six new titles to be released this Fall for the Nintendo Wii. Of those, one is a new Harry Potter game specifically designed for the new video game system. The Wii's primary new feature is its controller, which is held with one hand and waved at the screen. From this, it's easy to assume that the developers could create an area of the game that lets you cast spells with a flick of your wrist.
Dan Radcliffe has released his most recent newsletter. Be sure to head over to DanRadcliffe.com to check it out.
Last week, M. Night Shyamalan told ComingSoon.net that he has put some serious thought into directing either of the final two Potter films. On this Sunday's edition of PotterCast, Melissa Anelli talks with Shyamalan about the boy wizard. In a preview on Leaky's site, the director states he would offer the "greatest protection" on author JK Rowling's work.
Finally, an article published today in JAM! Television reports that Robbie Coltrane has "just wrapped his scenes on the fifth Harry Potter movie." All filming for Order of the Phoenix is scheduled to be completed by late Fall. We are officially less than one year away from the release of the fifth film. The movie is slated to be released in United States and United Kingdom on July 13, 2007.
That's all the news for this July 15th, 2006 edition of MuggleCast. Back to the show.
Andrew: All right, thank you Micah. [laughs]
Andrew: Wow, we've a few announcements to get to this week. Oh, how could I be so silly. I almost forgot the latest batch of names for Micah Tannenbaum. This one comes from Ryan, 18 of Virginia who calls himself "The Nickname King."
Andrew: I really like these.
Jamie: Oh, I thought that his nickname was "King."
Kevin: Ryan, the "Nickname King."
Jamie: Not that he calls himself with the "Nickname King."
Andrew: What do you guys think of these? Micahscope. Huh, huh?
[Kevin and Jamie laugh]
Andrew: Tann-en the Sun. And, the Baum-badeer. Didn't we already think of that one?
Ben: I don't know.
Kevin: I think we did, yeah.
Ben: But, interestingly enough, today - just last night I went to the P.O. Box, okay? And, I open up the box and I pull out this letter and I start feeling it and I'm like, "Oh my gosh, it's like ten Subway gift cards."
Ben: And, I open it up and it says on it - there's like a piece of what looks like bathroom tile and it says "Formica" and below it is says "For Micah." [laughs]
Jamie: What? Does he collect, like bathroom tiles, or something?
Ben: No, no. Formica. It's like the top of the table.
Jamie: Oh right. [laughs] Yeah. That's clever. That's clever.
Ben: It said "For Micah."
Jamie: That's clever!
Ben: It was great.
Andrew: So you going to mail that to him?
Ben: Of course.
Jamie: It's kind of heavy though, isn't it? To mail?
Kevin: Nope, he'll never see it.
Jamie: Yeah, he will never see it.
Andrew: It's a floor tile? Ben will put it in his room.
Ben: No, it's like a table top, but it looks like that. It's like a little sample.
Jamie: Here's a new name for him. When Micah starred in The Flintstones as Barney's baby, what was he called?
Ben: I don't know.
Andrew: I don't know.
Jamie: Have you guys seen The Flintstones?
Eric: Wait, I saw The Flintstones. What about it?
Andrew: I haven't seen it since '94.
Jamie: What's Barney's baby called?
Eric: Barney's baby? Oh, Bam-Bam.
Jamie: Yeah, so change it a bit for Micah. "Baum-Baum."
Eric: [sings] Shake your Baum-Baum. Shake your Baum-Baum.
Andrew: All right, that's Joke One of Jamie's Joke of the Day.
Andrew: We've got quite a few announcements this week. Don't forget to vote for us on Podcast Alley because if you don't, we will cry ourselves to sleep and there will be no MuggleCast.
Ben: Are we in the lead on Podcast Alley?
Andrew: No. Pottercast is still beating us.
Ben: Really? Even after last week?
Andrew: Yeah. By like 20 votes though, not that much.
Eric: Oh guys, don't forget that...
Andrew: It's pretty tight competition this week.
Eric: That's because their fans have more to do than homework when they're at home.
Eric: Don't forget that.
Andrew: Well, see, their offering their listeners an incentive for voting for them.
Jamie: Which is what?
Andrew: John's going to sing a song in New York for Jo, "New York, New York."
Jamie: Well, fine then...
Andrew: We've got to offer them something. Jamie, what would you want to do?
Eric: You know, I'm very upset.
Jamie: I want to... Okay, if they vote for us and we win, then Ben will, I don't know.
Ben: I'll sing "Photograph" for everybody. [laughs]
Jamie: Yeah. Yeah, you can... No, no...
Ben: [sings] "Look at this photograph..."
Jamie: You can sing "You're Beautiful" by James Blunt.
Andrew: Oh, I like that, yeah.
Ben: [sings] "You smile at me on a subway..."
Eric: On a subway. [laughs]
Ben: [Sings] "You're with another man..."
Jamie: What did...
Ben: [Sings] "You smiled at me in the subway..."
Andrew: Ben, are you promising people that?
Jamie: What did James Blunt say... Hey Ben, what did James Blunt say to the 12-inch cheese steak when the cheese steak grinned at him? [laughs]
Ben: [sings] "You smiled at me in the subway..."
Ben: Actually, here's what I'm thinking.... Okay, if I get... I'm probably leaving Monday, so I wouldn't be able to know. Let's see. Okay, if we beat them by more than 100 votes, I'll do it.
Jamie: Do what? Sing "You're beautiful?" Okay.
Andrew: [laughs] All right, it's on.
Ben: No, I don't know. I don't want to sing it. I don't want to do it. I can't do it.
Kevin: But where's he going to sing it?
Ben: I can't do it. I can't do it. I'm too big of a...
Andrew: All right.
Eric: I'll sing something.
Andrew: Jamie, you want to offer something?
Ben: Jamie will do it.
Jamie: No, I won't. I'm already eating the sausages if Harry dies, I can't take any more punishment.
Eric: Jamie, your sausages are very, very popular.
Jamie: Yeah, well what can I say? Jumbo ones.
Andrew: All right, Eric what will you do if...?
Eric: What will I do?
Jamie: He'll provide 500 photos for the fans. Oh no, wait, he's already done that.
Ben: He'll make another PhotoBucket.
Eric: Alright, if we get--if we beat Pottercast, I will sing, in person, a...
Ben: An Elton John song. He'll sing "Rocketman."
Jamie: "Rocketman," yeah.
Eric: Well yeah, no. I'll do that for free. I'll do that for free.
Ben: [sings] "I left last night, pre-flight."
Eric: But anyway, there's a Brittany Spears song "Lucky." You know "Lucky" by Brittany Spears?
Ben: No, I don't.
Jamie: No, we don't know.
Eric: A few of the people who run EvannaLynchFans.net or another one of the other Evanna Lynch sites have a filk, or I guess a parody of it that they wanted me to sing for them. I told them I would. I would record it, called "Looney" for Luna Lovegood and it's based on Brittany Spear's "Lucky" and I will sing that in person if we beat PotterCast on Podcast Alley.
Andrew: All right, wonderful. And an update on Lumos and New York City, don't forget people to RSVP. We have over... If you e-mailed an RSVP back before the new Leaky Mug site to hplive at gmail dot com, we ask you to RSVP again on the Leaky Mug - or, not "The Leaky Mug" - just LeakyMug.com because it's much easier to count the RSVPs up that way. We have over 200 RSVPs for Lumos and over 600 RSVPs [laughs] for New York.
Jamie: Hey Andrew, and your test this week is, can you remember what "RSPV", sorry "RSVP" stands for?
Ben: Re-pa vous le-on [Attempts to speak French, but fails miserably]
Eric: Respondez, s'il vous plait.
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah, that's what I would say.
Jamie: Repondez, s'il vous plait. Very close, very close.
Andrew: We actually have a story about that, Jamie, for our Chicken Soup this week.
Jamie: Oh yeah, we do!
Andrew: If you read it. Okay, Eric did you have an announcement about Lumos and New York, or Lumos?
Eric: Okay, so after the performance of Harry and the Potters, I wanted to get together in maybe the lobby of the JW Marriot or someplace. I don't know. I'm not very sure about the legality of any of this, but I wanted to get together and "popcorn read" one of the books in the Harry Potter series. Do you guys know what a popcorn reading is? It's when you read, like...
Andrew: Yeah, I did this when I was four. [laughs]
Eric: You read a little bit. Well, we'll all have name tags and...
Jamie: What is it? What do you have to do?
Eric: Popcorn reading. Okay, well you take a book and you start reading it, I guess you do voices and everything like that and then, when you get tired of reading, you say "popcorn" - you stop reading and you say "popcorn" - and then you pick someone else and then they start reading. And the deal is we'll have a bunch of fans who don't know each other - the key is that you don't know each other. A bunch of fans will get together and they'll read - I guess it's Prisoner of Azkaban I wanted to read - and we'll just read a little bit of it. It will be like an hour or two after 10:00 or 8:00 when Harry and the Potters is done. And, we'll just hear fellow fans doing the voices of all our beloved characters and just reading the book. It's just some kind of cool cozy reading corner with Eric and you. Super Awesome Vegas Magical Outing at Night with Eric and You. Okay, and anybody who might be interested in coming to this, please email me at gasmoney at staff dot mugglenet dot com and you'll either receive an update or I'll know how many people are interested. And then I will see by next week or at Lumos if I can actually do that. If we're allowed to congregate in a big lobby or something. So, once again, this is the Super Awesome Vegas Magical Outing at Night with Eric and You, "savegasmoney" is the acronym and call - email gasmoney at staff dot mugglenet dot com.
Andrew: As most of you know, every single week a new transcript goes up of the past week's show and as everyone knows Micah Tannenbaum, or...
Andrew: ...Micahscope heads that - or that - [laughs] heads that section. And he has quite a few transcribers who we would like to take a moment to thank. So, to Sarah, Ally, Martina, Jessica, Amanda, Roni, Rhiannon, David, and Margaret, and Emily, thank you very much for helping out...
Jamie: Thank you!
Andrew: ...with the transcripts. And, we'll be seeing a few of them up in New York and we'll be giving them a MuggleCast t-shirt.
Jamie: And hugs.
Andrew: Listener Rebuttals this week, Kylie, 32 of LA writes about the Mirror of Erised discussion we had last week.
"I absolutely loved your last discussion about the Mirror of Erised and whether Harry could use it for guidance to find Horcruxes. I just wanted to remind you guys that Dumbledore told Harry in Book One that the Mirror offers no knowledge nor truth.
In my opinion, even though Harry saw his "family", most of those characters that he saw were not real people, but people he had a deep and desperate desire to share life with. This is because we know that James was an only child and Lily's only living relative was Petunia. Therefore, all the people he saw in the Mirror were most likely people who could possibly be relatives, but were either dead or not real.
That brings me to my next opinion, that there's absolutely no way he can use the Mirror to find the Horcruxes, unless of course it was intended so with an enchantment, like the Philosopher's Stone. Because the mirror does not offer truth or knowledge, one can not use it to seek either one."
Jamie: I think that's a brilliant point, and that's completely changed our discussion from last week.
Ben: Yeah, sorry.
Jamie: Yeah, sorry, we're stupid. [laughs]
[Andrew and Ben laugh]
Eric: Wait, has it really?
Jamie: Yeah. We said that it's a contradiction that the Mirror can show only your heart's desire, but it couldn't tell you something that it wasn't common knowledge, like the meaning of life.
Jamie: But what she's just said is that's completely wrong because it shows neither knowledge nor truth. So, that's one to Kylie, zero to us.
Ben: Our next Listener Rebuttal comes from Grace, age 17, from Minnesota. Subject: The Mirror of Erised.
"Hi guys, love the show! On Episode 47, you were talking about the possibility of Harry seeing how to find a Horcrux within the Mirror of Erised. However, in her interview with Emerson and Melissa, Jo said Harry 'would have to see Voldemort finished, dead, gone, wouldn't he? Because he knows now that he will have no peace and no rest until that this is accomplished.' This means that since finishing off Voldemort is his ultimate heart's desire, the Mirror won't show him Horcruxes, since they are only a means to fulfilling that goal."
Jamie: I think that's a really, really good point. I was thinking that last week when we were talking about it, but I don't think I mentioned it. I think that he - your heart's desire has got to be the final piece of the puzzle. It can't be the means, because clearly you want the end more than you want the means. So, yeah. I think that's exactly right.
Eric: Harry's heart's desire changed. At first it was to see his family, and then at the end of it, it was to get the Sorcerer's Stone and all that. And I really think that if Harry wanted it deep enough, he could see getting a Horcrux. If he had one Horcrux left and he...
Jamie: But he doesn't want it!
Eric: He wants to find a Horcrux to kill it!
Jamie: But his...
Eric: He needs to do...
Jamie: Okay, but Eric, but Eric, it's a shortcut to - that he'd rather have the end, so why would you... Okay, say if you wanted to cycle two states, yeah? You could either look in the mirror and see a brand new bike that's worth $50,000, or you can see yourself at the place. Which would you rather? You'd see yourself at the place, since you'd rather be there.
Eric: But you need the Horcrux! What I'm saying is - no. I'm not saying, I'm not saying he could actually retrieve the Horcrux from the Mirror. That doesn't - he obviously wants to use it, but...
Jamie: No, but his true desire wouldn't ever be to see a Horcrux.
Kevin: Yeah, but Jamie...
Jamie: His true desire would be to finish Voldemort. Yeah?
Kevin: I think Eric's point is that maybe you're going to see that bike at first, right, having the bike at first. But when you start working for the bike and you start earning that money, when you're like, "Oh my god, this is killing me," you may see yourself going...
Kevin: "Oh geez, I really want to see myself at the bike place buying it."
Eric: No. What I'm saying is that Harry's desire changed. At first he wanted to see his family, then he wanted to get - it's an immediate thing. You can look into the mirror and see different things depending on your...
Jamie: It's not immediate. Of course it's not immediate! It's built up, it's like pent up...
Jamie: The deepest - well, the deepest most desperate desire in your heart doesn't just change momentarily just like Ben's band of the moment.
Eric: It does change! It does change. It changed for Harry in Book One.
Jamie: No! No! But - yes, it does, but it doesn't just change suddenly. Events in the real world change it. It's like that.
Eric: Well, yeah. But events in the real world like Harry - what I'm saying is I think that if he wanted to find a Horcrux and if his heart's desire was to find a Horcrux, there's no reason why he shouldn't see that just because it would mean defeating Voldemort. Sure he wants to defeat...
Jamie: What would he rather find, though?
Eric: He would rather defeat Voldemort, but...
Jamie: How can his deepest, most desperate desire in his heart be any less than that goal, now? Especially after Dumbledore has died, Sirius has died. It's a war.
Jamie: How could he ever want to have a lesser deepest desire than that? And anyway, as Grace points out, it can't show truth or knowledge, so it couldn't show him finding a Horcrux. It could show him holding it, but that would be pointless.
Jamie: You know?
Eric: Truth or knowledge; I think that was just the way Dumbledore chose to explain it. Truth or knowledge was to deter Harry from staring at it.
Jamie: No, no, no. But it didn't...
Eric: But, I...
Jamie: It didn't actually show him truth or knowledge. It just showed him holding it. So, if you - if the most deepest, most desperate desire in your heart is to have the Philosopher's Stone, you'd see yourself holding it, you wouldn't see yourself finding it, and it was just so that the enchantment works.
Kevin: If you - if Harry found all the Horcruxes except one, right? Ron and Hermione both died...
Kevin: ...trying to find that last Horcrux, right? And all he needs is finding that last Horcrux to kill Voldemort, I think if he looked in the Mirror of Erised, he'd see himself holding that last Horcrux and not killing Voldemort.
Jamie: No, I disagree. I disagree.
Ben: No, that's not true because the purpose, the sole reason that he's in it anymore is he... Okay! His deepest desire isn't to find the Horcruxes; it's what he's going to do with the Horcruxes, which is defeat Voldemort.
Jamie: Exactly, yeah, yeah.
Ben: So, okay. If you're in his situation. Okay! For example, earlier I went to Subway, and say my greatest, deepest desire was to eat Subway. Would I see myself eating the sandwich or would I see myself driving there?
Jamie: Exactly. You'd see yourself eating the sandwich. You wouldn't see yourself driving there.
Eric: But, if you wanted to make it to Subway - if you wanted to make it to Subway, you would see yourself making it to Subway.
Ben: Why would Harry's greatest desire be to fight Voldemort? It's to have Voldemort dead.
Andrew: I have another Listener Rebuttal that I just found, because we've been getting a lot of feedback about this discussion because it...
Ben: Hold on.
Andrew: It's been going back and forth so much.
Eric: This is Lisa, 16, from San Diego. Her subject is also Mirror of Erised. Lisa says:
"I disagree with what you were saying in the latest MuggleCast about the Mirror of Erised, because the Mirror doesn't give you what you want most, it shows you what you want most. So, if someone's most heartfelt desire really was to know the meaning of life, it would show that person knowing that secret, not give them the answer."
I agree with that.
"So if the person desired to know the meaning of life so that they could be at peace or teach others or make the world a better place, they would see themselves doing these things or being these things, but not the meaning of life itself. So, I don't think the Mirror would show Harry where the Horcruxes were, but would rather show him what he would do with them."
Jamie: This is exactly right, exactly what we were just talking about and what Grace said, that it can't show you - it can't give you what you want apart from when Dumbledore made it so. It just shows you what you want. I think that's a brilliant point. I think that's really good.
Eric: Yeah, I would agree with that. I think this said it a little bit clearer for me, at least to understand where you guys were coming from, that it would show Harry destroying the Horcruxes as opposed to finding the Horcruxes. Though, I guess I would argue if he really wanted to find them, if that was his...
Jamie: The point she's making is that you wouldn't see yourself destroying it in the Cave because the Mirror can't know that it's in the cave. You just see yourself, I don't know, against a white background just destroying it, because it can't show you whatever. And perhaps if you perceive the Horcrux to be, say, a cup, then you'd see it being a cup. It's your subconscious that tells you what you think it would be, so it can't actually tell you anything you don't know. It's just a projection of what you think.
Ben: Our next Listener Rebuttal comes from Niamh, age 14, from Illinois. The subject: Snape's Protective "Instinct."
"In regards to Episode 47, I'd like to comment on the Snape protecting the Trio issue. I agree that it could be a teacher's instinct, but I personally think the Snape isn't pure evil. He must have some compassion in him. It's hard to tell what side Snape is on, but I don't think that, at this point in his life, he would kill (or let die) an innocent student or anyone else unless he really, really had to. It's just hard for me to picture Snape that cruel. He always seemed more humane than many of the other Death Eaters. Thanks!"
Jamie: He is. That's the thing; he's mean, he's not cruel. I think that's a distinction you've got to make.
Andrew: I do think so. But, I mean, then again, this was what occurred in the movie, so we shouldn't be theorizing about this too much.
Ben: That's true.
Andrew: Because it was just Steve Kloves going, "Hey! This would be nice."
Kevin: Yeah, it was an interpretation of the book. So.
Andrew: So, moving along to our main discussion this week: the Room of Requirement, spawned by Jamie Lawrence. So Jamie, this is all you.
Jamie: Yes, I built the room. I built the Room of Requirement.
Andrew: No, no, no. [laughs]
Jamie: Well, I thought this would be an extremely interesting topic because it's one of those things where you can't see where its brain is kept, so we can't really examine it. We don't know who made it, where it came from. It's kind of a second Chamber of Secrets, except it doesn't have a Basilisk in it.
Kevin: Which is good. [laughs]
Jamie: Exactly. But I'm sure if you - it is good, but I'm sure if you passed and wished for one, one would appear. Or would it?
Jamie: I don't know! That's the kind of thing we're going to be discussing. Does it have limitations? Could you ask for a room that makes yourself immortal forever, and do the effects of the room only last while you're inside? So, these are the kinds of things we're going to be discussing.
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