MuggleCast | The #1 Most-Listened to Harry Potter Podcast

MuggleCast 90 Transcript

Show Intro

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Andrew: Today's MuggleCast is also brought to you by Borders. It won't be long before the much-anticipated release of Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. Do you have your mind made up about where Severus Snape's loyalties lie? Do you think he'll betray Harry and his friends, or will he help them to triumph over He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named? Find out more about this complex character in the hot new book The Great Snape Debate available only at Borders. Remember to reserve Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows at Borders to save 40 percent. [Show music begins to play]

Micah: Because the highlight of Spiderman 3 was watching the Order of the Phoenix trailer - thank you Zach, 21, of Philadelphia - this is MuggleCast Episode 90 for May 13th, 2007.

Ben: Guys, I don't believe it. I'm done with high school.

Kevin: Who let you out of high school?

Ben: I don't know, but they did. Today was my last day ever.

Mikey: You sound just as excited about it, too.

[Micah laughs]

Mikey: You're like, "Ooo, yeah, party."

Ben: Well, I am, dude. High school's done, man! I was just shocked. I can't believe it's over.

Micah: Are you going to graduate?

Ben: Welcome back to MuggleCast, everybody. Yes, I am graduating, Micah. Next week.

Micah: Well, congratulations.

Ben: Next Sunday. Thank you.

Mikey: Where's my invitation?

Ben: Oh, I'm sorry, Mikey. It must have gotten lost in the mail. But you're invited. Come by.

Mikey: Okay. I will. I'll just roll on out to the middle of nowhere and I'll see you.

Ben: Oh, be quiet. Welcome back, everybody. I'm Ben Schoen.

Kevin: I'm Kevin Steck.

Eric: I am Eric Scull.

Micah: I'm Micah Tannenbaum.

Mikey: And I'm Mikey B.

[Intro music concludes]


Ben: Let's to Micah Tannenbaum for a look at this past week's Harry Potter news stories.

Micah: All right. Thanks, Ben.

The U.S. Harry Potter audio book narrator is set to play host to Barnes & Noble's Deathly Hallows release party. The event will commence at 10:30 PM, on July 20th, at the Barnes and Noble in Union Square. Dale will discuss how he got the role of narrator, how he creates his characters' voices, and read excerpts from previous Harry Potter books.

A new listing on Barnes & Noble's website is promoting an upcoming box set of all seven Harry Potter novels. Due to be released on September 18th, according to Barnes and Noble's website, the books will be enclosed in a cool case that includes a privacy lock and sticker set. The listing price is $195, but Barnes & Noble has a discounted pre-order of $136.50.

Film Music Weekly recently conducted an interview with Nicholas Hooper, the man who composed the score for the fifth Harry Potter film. In this interview, Nicholas discusses in detail various themes on the soundtrack.

And according to Warner Brothers' new Dumbledore's Army website, the fifth Harry Potter movie will be rated PG-13 in the United States. Order of the Phoenix is the second film in the series to receive this rating; Goblet of Fire was the first.

And speaking of Warner Brothers, they confirmed earlier this week that Order of the Phoenix will be released on July 12th, 2007, in the U.K. That is one day earlier than originally scheduled, and U.S. fans will still have to wait until the 13th to see it in theaters.

In addition to the July 12th release in the U.K., Yahoo! U.K. has released another Order of the Phoenix trailer that runs 1 minute and 2 seconds long. Unfortunately, there are no new clips.

For all the latest news, screenshots, posters and interviews related to the fifth movie be sure to head over to

Warner Brothers has announced that the popular 20Q game will be released with Harry Potter answers later this year. The game works by asking the player twenty questions. Once all of them are answered, the system tries to guess what person, place, or thing the person is thinking. Radica, the company behind the game, is asking Potter fans to help train the system by visiting their official website and clicking on "Harry Potter" at the top.

Finally, J.K. Rowling updated her site during the week to answer a few Frequently Asked Questions, as well as update her fan site award. Can we expect more to come? Maybe?

That's all the news for this May 13th, 2007, edition of MuggleCast. Happy Mother's Day. Back to the show.

Jo's Update

Ben: Thank you for that, Micah. Now we have a little bit of news to discuss. Micah, didn't you have some requests for Jo? Did you do a little "what's bugging you" thing? No.

Micah: I did.

Ben: And did she come through for you?

Micah: She did. It was a little bit delayed, though. It was a little delayed. But nonetheless, she did come through. She updated her F.A.Q. section earlier this week, and we got some interesting information out of it.

Ben: Yeah, let's talk a little bit about that information that we did get. Now, we learned that we don't know what Draco's Patronus is, and I don't know if you guys think that's going to be significant or not, but she gave us quite a bit of information about the exact date of Voldemort's birth, and the houses that Tonks and Myrtle were in, and, by the way, they were in Hufflepuff and Ravenclaw, respectively. So, Micah, was this quite the update you were expecting or were you wanting a little more?

Micah: I was expecting a little bit more.

Eric: Oh, Micah.

Micah: I mean, I don't know if these are pressing questions. I mean, even the one that she answered concerning Draco's wand, I mean, who cares, honestly? Do you guys care?

Eric: Oh, Micah, Micah, Micah.

Mikey: I care. I care. I care. Come on.

Eric: Dude, I care.

Ben: Did they - I don't think it - Micah makes a good point, though. It's not exactly...

Kevin: Like vital, yeah.

Ben: ...imperative information. It's not imperative, but it's - I don't...

Kevin: It's interesting. It's interesting.

Ben: Yeah, it's interesting, yeah.

Kevin: Yeah, but it's not like great stuff - juicy stuff that we want.

Eric: But we're not going to get it. We're not going to get that stuff. We're not going to get the juicy, juicy - you know, I mean, Micah begged her, said that if he could he was going to get down on his hands and knees to make her update her site, and so she did, but now you're - now you guys want even more. She's a busy woman. Come on, guys.

Ben: Yeah, that's a good point.

Mikey: She's working hard on that Harry Potter book. I mean she's done.

Micah: Exactly.

Ben: No, she's still...

Mikey: I just want to know.

Ben: She's still editing. She's still editing.

Eric: Well, no, the editing is gone. The editing is over because they have a page count, but...

Kevin: Oh, that's true. Yeah.

Ben: That's a good point, too. Yeah.

Kevin: I don't think it's about her being busy...

Ben: She is done. [laughs]

Kevin: I think it's just what we were saying before. She doesn't want to give anything away. She's...

Ben: Well, I guess, guys, we'll just have to wait ourselves, you know...

Micah: See, but I don't agree with that, though.

Ben: Oho! I...

Mikey: Was it 71 days?

[Micah laughs]

Ben: Yeah, just a whole 71 days and then find out all this information without reading on her website. [laughs] I don't know. I think it's interesting stuff to know and, like Eric says, we aren't going to get any real juicy stuff.

Micah: She tried a little bit, though. She tried...

Eric: Yeah.

Micah: She tried messing around with us with the whole invisibility cloak question that she posted. So...

Eric: Oh, wait. What was that?

Micah: When she asked why - was it Dumbledore? - had James' invisibility cloak the night that...

Ben: Yeah.

Micah: ...Voldemort was in Godric's Hallow.

Eric: Oh, was this a recent update?

Ben: This was a while ago.

Micah: This was months ago.

Ben: We've discussed this months ago.

Eric: Oh, okay. I thought this was months ago, but I wasn't sure. What were you trying to say, Micah?

Micah: What I was saying...

Eric: Oh, was that when she kind of tested the water...

Micah: Yeah. I mean, she can mess around with us...

Ben: Yeah, that's true.

Micah: ...if she wanted to. I mean, we're still expecting a couple of updates before the book, right? I mean, she does generally do that kind of thing.

Ben: Well, speaking of which, Micah, how long is this mini-update she did now going hold you over for? When are you going to need some more updates, huh?

Micah: Oh, I was ready after I read it. I mean, come on.

Eric: Wow, Micah.

Ben: [laughs] Hold on, hold on...

Mikey: A little demanding.

Ben: We'll save a "What's Bugging Micah?" for another day, but right now we have some announcements to get to.


Ben: Vote for us on PodcastAlley. I don't know where we're at right now. Let me take a look, see here. I'll type it into my Google. Not my Google, my Firefox here to see what we are ranked.

Kevin: Third.

Ben: Loading, loading, loading. Okay, right now we are number three. Number three behind Keith and the Girl, and Free Talk Live. So, go vote for us. We are the only Harry Potter podcast in the top 10. Thank you for making us the number 1 Harry Potter podcast that you listen to. It's awesome. We love you guys. So, go vote for us there some more. Let's see here.

Oh, how could I forget? I'm so silly. This summer there is a lot going on with MuggleNet and MuggleCast. I want each and every one of you to be there for the ride. Now we have Enlightening 2007. Micah, what are the dates for that?

Micah: They are, I believe, July 12th through the 15th? I should just double check on that, but I know we're doing the podcast the night of the 12th, right? Thursday, July 12th?

Ben: Yeah, I think that sounds about right. So, yeah. We have Enlightening where Andrew, Micah, and myself will be there. And you can discuss things with us. Come and have a good time. Then we have Prophecy 2007, another convention this time, this one is in Toronto, Canada, and we are actually going to be having the podcast at midnight. So, come out and see us there. The next event you can find us at is the U.S. premiere and the U.K. premiere. The U.S. premiere is held on the 8th of July, is that correct?

Mikey: Ah, yeah.

Ben: On the 8th of July, and the U.K. premiere is on...when is it, guys? Do you know?

Micah: July 3rd.

Ben: On the 3rd of July. So, yeah. We are going to have shows then, so you can come out and mingle with the MuggleCasters. That will be a good time, and right now we are talking about doing some possible other shows around the country. It just really depends on what exactly we are doing. So, hopefully that all works out. You can find out all the full details on our Summer Tour Schedule coming up on the MuggleCast website.

Another thing: MuggleCast fans, listen here, all right. If you are a hardcore MuggleCast fan. If you are the Number 1 MuggleCast fan, if you are going to be the MuggleCast fan who is at Prophecy, who is at Enlightening, who is at the premieres, who is at all of our Live shows, then we have the thing just for you. Don't we, Micah?

Micah: Yes, we do.

Ben: Pickle Pack. It's been released for two weeks now. We have a bunch of members, but we are always in the need of more. It's for the hardcore MuggleCast fan only. It's your home to bonus audio, videos, pictures, secret show info, and much, much more. Registration is only open until June 16th. Remember that. June 16th is the last day we are taking signups. We don't even know if we are going to open them again. It will at least be a year, if we do open signups again. So, today is your last chance to sign up. So, please hurry and sign up today.

Mikey: I'm a member. [laughs]

Ben: Mikey's always - Mikey's a member.

Mikey: I love it.

Ben: Mikey is one of our first members...

Eric: So, Mikey...

Ben: He loves the pickle pack.

Eric: So Mikey, are you pleased with what you've received so far? As a Pickle Pack...

Mikey: Oh, of course. I'm waiting for my t-shirt to come in, you know, I'm excited! I got to see all the "Bickles."

Eric: Blickles.

Mikey: I think the name is amazing. The Blickles are amazing.

[Eric laughs]

Mikey: Jamie and Ben's and Andrew's. I love it. I'm a proud member.

Ben: One final announcement here. Go ahead and pick up our book,'s What Will Happen in Harry Potter 7. The success for this book has been mind-blowing, to say the least. It's been incredible how many sales we've gotten; how much media coverage we've gotten over this thing. Our book is up to Number 2 on the New York Times Best Seller List this week. According to Nielsen Book Sales, it's the 58th overall best selling book in the country, the 14th best selling paperback, and the 4th best selling children's book. And the 1st best selling children's nonfiction book. So, thank you. Thanks to everybody. This is all because of all of you. Everyone who has bought the book. Remember, you can order it online through our online retailer, known as Alivan's. is selling the book. You can order it through there and support the site and the show. So please do that, if you haven't yet. It will help hold you over these last 70 days until we finally get our hands on Book 7. So...

Mikey: No mention of the tour? Of the book tour, Ben?

Ben: Yes. Oh yeah. Good point, Mikey. We're going to be on tour. Visit MuggleNet dot com slash booktour dot shtml. You can find all of our dates. We're going to be in California, then we're going to be in Ohio; Portland, Maine; New York; Washington D.C.; Baltimore - all of these places - Connecticut. We're going to be all over promoting the book. You can come out and meet us. We'll have a good time. So...

Mikey: It should be fun, right, Ben?

Ben: Yeah. It's going to be a great time. Mikey's actually the driver while we're in California. So, if you want to meet The Mikey B. The Mikey [mispronounces] Bouchereau.

Eric: Wait.

Ben: Come out and see us. [laughs]

Eric: Mikey, you're not going to be the driver in Portland? Not in Portland?

Mikey: No, no. I just want to be California. That's it. California. That's my home state.

Eric: Yeah. Okay, so not in Portland.

Ben: Mikey's our...

Mikey: I'm the California contact. [laughs]

Eric: [laughs] Yeah.

Mikey: I guess. I guess. I don't know. So what's up next, guys?

Listener Rebuttal: Music for Movie 5

Ben: Well, we have some rebuttals this week. Some people who had a problem with what we said on last week's show. [laughs] I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding, some people may have some disagreements here. Our first e-mail comes from Bruce, age 17, of New York. And he's talking about the music for Order of the Phoenix.

Hey, MuggleCasters! I was listening to Episode 88 today and was interested in your brief discussion of the 'Order of the Phoenix' music. Andrew mistakingly states Peter Doyle as the composer for the new film, when in fact, says Nicholas Hooper has composed the music for 'Order of the Phoenix' and Patrick Doyle was the composer for 'Goblet of Fire.'

Ben: Whoops, Andrew! He says:

No worries, Andrew! Everyone makes mistakes. But I am still a bit disappointed that John Williams has not composed the newest HP movie soundtrack.

Kevin: Yeah.


Should I just be content with the fantastic legacy he has already left on the Harry Potter world?

Eric: Yes.


Love the show.

Eric: Yes. You should be.

Ben: End quote. I don't know. I've never really had an opinion on the composers. Because I've listened to the - you know, you hear the music in the movie. And I always think that's good. But I've never really purchased the soundtrack and listened to it fully, so...I know, terrible fan. What do you guys think?

Kevin: I think they should just be satisfied with the work that has already been done. I mean, it's not likely John Williams is coming back. So, you know, he set the stage for the other composers and they've built upon his work.

Ben: Yeah, I think John Williams did a fantastic job.

Kevin: Yeah, it was a great foundation.

Ben: Right. And I think that...

Mikey: Was there a reason...

Ben: Patrick Doyle and Nicholas Hooper are probably - Patrick Doyle, I enjoyed the music in Goblet of Fire. I thought it was great. I think...

Micah: Yeah.

Ben: Hooper's likely to do the same. I don't think we're going to be disappointed with the soundtrack. So...

Kevin: I don't think there was a reason, Mikey.

Mikey: Oh yeah, I didn't know if there was...

Kevin: I don't know if there was a reason why John Williams left. Probably just for his own reasons, John Williams, you know?

Ben: He might have just wanted to move on, you know?

Kevin: It could have been, you know, costs. It could have been him just wanting to move on.

Eric: Yeah, it could have been a number of things, really.

Kevin: We don't know. But, I mean either way, just because it's John Williams doesn't - or just because it's not John Williams doesn't mean that we're not going to get great music.

Eric: Oh no, and that's why...

Mikey: That's very true.

Eric: That's why they can still have the rights to "Hedwig's Theme" and stuff like that. You know? And once John Williams came in and created the world out of it, and come up with the, you know - he has several different underlying, kind of, musical themes?

Kevin: Scores?

Eric: Yeah, themes?

Kevin: Yep.

Eric: That just get, not recycled, but reinvented...

Ben: Yeah.

Eric: ...throughout all the movies that he does. And so, when he left in 3, I thought that Prisoner of Azkaban's score was, like, vastly new. I mean, Chamber of Secrets was too. Just like Chamber of Secrets was before that. But, he left with quite a good few things just to possibly - for other composers to take off of. And just the fact that...

Kevin: Oh, yeah, definitely.

Eric: know. And, so the rights of the film, etcetera, that allow other composers to do "Hedwig's Theme." I mean, that's all you really need, "Hedwig's Theme," in a Harry Potter movie.

Ben: Yeah, that's the main one.

Micah: Well...

Eric: And because of the - well, sorry, I just, I'm just going to finish up here. I just think that the movies now, four and five and stuff, have been done in a certain way where the music does enhance the plot, but it's not as mystical, I guess, as the previous movies were. You know, they - I wouldn't say they relied on the music but they're just different movies where it doesn't really call for all these different themes, like Umbridge can have her own theme and stuff, but it's just not - I'm not paying attention to music as much as I used to.

Ben: Yeah, good point, Eric.

Mikey: He - there was actually a reason, and I was searching online because I remember one of my film music teachers telling me about this, why he didn't continue on. I found it online: he was actually contracted to George Lucas and Steven Spielberg for their films at the time of Goblet of Fire. That's why he wasn't able to do work with Warner Brothers on the new Harry Potter film.

Eric: Ohhh.

Ben: Oooh.

Mikey: He was doing War of the Worlds for Spielberg and he was doing Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith with George Lucas.

Eric: Oh, my gosh.

Ben: Both great movies, both great music. [laughs]

Mikey: And so - but he was - obviously they went with Patrick Doyle. I think the music was really good, so obviously they didn't lose out too much, you know, like you said. Williams made the world with the music, and it's just continued on. I don't know if there was another reason why he couldn't do it with this one, but...

Ben: He quit.

Listener Rebuttal: Voldemort's Eyes

Ben: Right, but we have some more rebuttals to get to here. Chris, age 20, from Missouri writes - he wants to discuss Voldemort's red eyes, by the way - and he writes:

Hello, MuggleCast, I am a relatively new listener, and I really enjoy your show. I have a response about the question of why Voldemort has red eyes. I remember watching an interview/behind the scenes that I believe it was the director who said they decided to change Voldemort's red eyes because, on film, red or dark eyes do not express emotion as well, and they thought with blue eyes, that they could really display Voldemort's emotions and expressions a lot better. Sorry, this is kind of a broad answer, but that is all that I can remember. I currently don't have access to the copy of 'The Goblet of Fire' to recall the details. I hope this helps. All you guys are very entertaining. Keep it going. Chris.

Micah: A number of people wrote in saying that Heyman actually talked about...

Ben: So it's probably true. [laughs]

Micah: ...that. Yeah, on behind the scenes, the Goblet of Fire DVD, basically what this guy is saying - sorry, forgot his name, Chris - what Chris was saying is accurate, that he didn't feel that Voldemort's character could be portrayed the right way. You couldn't see sort of the emotion in his eyes, so that's why they decided not to make them red. Not because they would scare little children, like we said on last week's show.

Eric: Yeah.

Mikey: Wow.

Ben: Yeah, I was pretty convinced that it's not because of scaring little children, I just didn't - I wasn't aware that David Heyman had said this. [laughs]

Eric: [laughs] Well, it's like...

Mikey: Wow, I was corrected there.

[Eric laughs]

Mikey: I thought it was because it scared children, but, you know.

Eric: Oh. Well, no, I mean...

Mikey: It would've scared me, it would've scared me, so I'm okay with it.

Eric: Yeah, it would've scared me, too.

Ben: Yeah, but, Mikey, you get scared by pretty much anything.

Mikey: I get scared by vacuum cleaners, too, just like Andrew's brother. So...

Micah: Ph geez [laughs]

Eric: Just like cats. Mikey, you're a cat. But no, the - now you can go up to Voldemort now and say, "Hey, you're so full of anger and hate that..."

[Kevin laughs]

Eric: "...your eyes are blue."

[Ben laughs]

Eric: [laughs] Nevermind.

Mikey: He's blue with anger.

Ben: He's blue with anger. [laughs]

[Eric and Mikey laugh]

Eric: [sings] Behind these hazel eyes...

Listener Rebuttal: The Photo of the Order

Ben: Thanks, Eric, thanks. [laughs] We have one final rebuttal this week from Karen, age 23, from Fargo, North Dakota.

Hey, guys, fun show tonight. After listening to you, I was looking at clips on YouTube and came across those ABC specials from 'Order of the Phoenix.' Remember those clips that were like 30 seconds a piece and they had one for Bellatrix, the D.A., the director, etcetera? Well, the clip for the Order seems to answer the question you got by one of the Pickle Pack, when she asked what piece of paper (a.k.a. the love note from Cho) Sirius was holding when talking to Harry at the train station. Well, in the clip you hear Sirius say, "That's the original Order." So it appears he is showing Harry the pic that Moody showed Harry in the book. Makes sense since we know Sirius also says, "It's your turn now, Harry," in that scene. I thought I'd pass that one. Back to studying for my final. Take care. Karen.

Kevin: She's linking one...

Ben: So what's she saying here, exactly?

Mikey: Last week we talked about that picture with Sirius at the train station with the scroll, we had no clue what it was. It's the picture of the Order.

Ben: Oh, okay, so she's...

Mikey: She's point something out...

Ben: Yeah, thanks.

Mikey: ...that we missed.

Ben: Thanks, Karen, for clarifying that. Well, that wraps up this week's listener rebuttals. Remember, if you have any problems with what we say on the show, if some information is not factual, or you have an opinion that does not agree with ours, go ahead and send us an e-mail telling us why you disagree with us to mugglecast at staff dot mugglenet dot com. Or if you want to attack one of us personally, you can e-mail our first name at staff dot mugglenet dot com.

Eric: And it's a good thing I don't check...

Ben: And we'll gladly reply to you. So... [laughs]

Main Discussion: The Symbol

Ben: Well, it's time to move on to this week's main discussion. We're going to be discussing that symbol. You know what symbol I'm talking about. You all know what symbol I'm talking about. Don't they, Micah?

Micah: I hope so, otherwise this will be a very short discussion.

Ben: Yeah.

[Eric laughs]

Ben: To figure out what we're talking about here, go to and the symbol we're talking about is now the centerpiece of Bloomsbury's website. So, Micah, you want to do a little explaining here?

Micah: Yeah, I mean, I think that when the covers first came out, we looked at the spine of the U.K. children's edition, and we were kind of wondering what that symbol was. And I know we came up with a couple different ideas here and there, and we weren't really sure well was itjust some Bloomsbury print logo that they happened to put on there for the final book? And we looked at some of the other past U.K. children's editions and saw that there were some pretty significant symbols that were on the bindings. So, I think now that Bloomsbury has taken it and thrown it in the middle of their site, we can be pretty certain that this is pretty important in the final book.

Ben: Right, and what's interesting is that whoever the illustrator is for the U.K. edition - I'm not familiar with who they are - they decided to take a different approach on making the cover, which they do with every book, of course, but if this is something that's really pivotal in a way, if it's key, if it's an important symbol, what's interesting is that it isn't on the American cover. So, Mary Grandpre must not have thought it was that important, I guess. I don't know. Do you guys have anything to say about that?

Kevin: I don't think that it necessarily wasn't that important, it's just that ehse didn't want to include it in her cover, you know? She chooses what she wants and what she thinks is interesting, and...

Ben: Right, but if we're saying that what's on the Bloomsbury cover - the symbol - if it's a significant symbol, you know, if it's something that pivotal, then why wouldn't it make the cover?

Kevin: Well, just because she chose...

Eric: Because it doesn't have to make both covers...

Kevin: Because she chose more - maybe not more pivotal, but just another important scene from the book that she wanted to portray. I mean, for all you know that symbol is written on a door, and she didn't want to paint the door.

[Eric laughs]

Ben: Well I guess it's true that - well, don't you remember with Half-Blood Prince when there was the ring on the spine, wasn't that right?

Mikey: That was on the U.K. version.

Kevin: Right.

Ben: Yeah, on the U.K. edition just like this, and that wasn't on the U.S. edition.

Kevin: Exactly, so...

Ben: I don't believe so. So, I guessed there are - if you look to the past, there have always been a little bit of difference between what's seen - I guess it's always been different.

Micah: Well, we haven't seen the inside flaps, though, have we? Of the U.S. edition?

Kevin: No, we haven't.

Mikey: Yeah, we have... Haven't we seen the full artwork, though?

Kevin: We have seen the full artwork, but I think Micah's referring to with their added text, and sometimes they add extra images in there, too. You know?

Micah: Yeah, I mean, I think Mary Grandpre was going for a very basic, not trying to give much away, whereas this U.K. edition - I mean, even putting the symbol aside has so much more on it than the American edition.

Mikey: Yeah.

Ben: And Bloomsbury has said that it does play a significant role, so that's not up in the question. It's just, what role does it play? I'm sure there's somebody out there who's studied ancient runes or something that could tell us what the symbol means, so if you have any idea what this symbol represents, please e-mail us. [laughs]

Eric: So Bloomsbury said it was important?

Ben: Yes.

Mikey: Yes. It's also on their website. Have you been to their site recently at all?

Eric: Yeah, if you go to

Ben: Yeah, we talked about that at little bit ago.

Eric: You go to the site, and there's this - is it a piece of chalk or something? That just scrapes across the screen; it goes [makes noise] fwoosh! Fwoosh! Fwoosh! To this like...

[Ben laughs]

Mikey: Wait, you forgot the circle part and the line.

Eric: And the circle and then the line that goes up, and I thought it was being slashed; I thought the new Zorro movie was coming out. But no, it's just this sign, this symbol for America Online that just keeps haunting all of us.

Mikey: You know...

Ben: Yeah. [laughs]

Mikey: I'm wondering if - because it looks like you said, chalk - what if it's in stone, maybe that's Dumbledore's stone that it's being written in? Because it's white.

Eric: Or it could be written in runes.

Mikey: Yeah, but it's being written on something that's kind of white, and I'm looking at the cover right now. It's the same - what's on the website is the same in this little section on the book cover, also. The same white section, so I don't know.

The Key of Solomon

Ben: Well see, we're having trouble here coming up with any explanation for what this symbol means, so let's get a few listener thoughts on the subject. Jeremy, 18, from Sydney - [says with an Australian accent] from down under... [laughs]

Eric: Ben, that was pretty good.

Ben: ...writes:

I've heard a lot of people think...

Was it? Thank you.

I've heard a lot of people thinking that the spinal art on 'Deathly Hallows' may be part of The Key of Solomon. The Key of Solomon is a book on magic attributed to King Solomon. It is divided into two books and contains the conjurations to summon spirits of the dead, spirits from Hell, and how to protect the conjurer. The book has many "magical circles" in that it is usually a type of symbol made up of circles and magic. In the past two books, the spine art has been very relevant, and possibly even a minor cause of the deaths at the end of each book. Sirius died working for the Order of the Phoenix, and in part Dumbledore died because he had weakened himself twice for Horcruxes (or at least Harry thinks he did). So what do you guys think? I'd love to hear your feedback! Thanks, Jeremy.

Mikey: Hmmm!

Kevin: You see the problem with the symbols is that...

Ben: I really don't know. You got something...

Mikey: He's got something.

Kevin: this time it can be anything. You know what I mean? We have absolutely no basis of where she is linking this symbol in history or in runes so, I could probably - you could probably find a hundred different meanings of the same symbol.

Ben: Well, this book that they're talking about reminds me of the Book of the Dead in - I think that's what it's called in The Mummy? Do you guys remember that movie?

Eric: Yeah, The Mummy. I was just thinking about that. It is the Golden Book of Amman Rah.

Ben: Yeah, that's it. It has basically all these things on how to summon spirits of the dead, spirits from Hell, and how they kill the Mummy at the end.

[Ben and Eric laugh]

Micah: Well, I like that. I like it because a lot of our discussions about Deathly Hallows was about the day where the Veil's the thinnest between the world of the living and the dead so, perhaps, this is how it's somehow tied to it?

Eric: Yeah.

Micah: I don't know.

Ben: So you do think that this indicates that, since Harry and Voldemort really can't duel and if Harry wants to eventually defeat Voldemort - we all pretty much agree that he will kill Voldemort - do you think that the fact that this is an ancient symbol or something, do you think that it can indicate that Harry is going to have to discover some form of ancient magic...

Eric: Well, Ben...

Ben: order to defeat Voldemort?

Eric: Well, Ben, the Book of Amman Rah, the character - Imhotep's last line in the movie is, "Death is only the beginning," and death was the very beginning of our Harry Potter series.

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